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is "power metal" dying?
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AAAAAAAAAA
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 3:47 am    Post subject: is "power metal" dying? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Click

Google trends, which reports search volume, seems to suggest yes. Wonder if our favorite bands are going to throw in the towel one of these days...

Discuss!

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robocop656
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 4:34 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

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AAAAAAAAAA
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 5:45 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Oh I can't stay serious around you.

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icecab21
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 11:28 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

with this i found that britney spears episode in 2007 was more popular than miley cryrus 2013 episode.
both those were more popular in search than Adele and she has outsold both of them

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browneyedgirl
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 4:07 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

icecab21 wrote:
with this i found that britney spears episode in 2007 was more popular than miley cryrus 2013 episode.
both those were more popular in search than Adele and she has outsold both of them


I guess that means if a female singer wants to be popular she has to show her ass-ets, Embarassed not just her singing voice.
Well, Adele is a BBW but she is not going the route of Britney or Miley, Adele has it together and doesn't need to be more flamboyant. Adele also has a child and I think she wants to be a good role model for him.

What about Lady Gaga? Confused She wears dresses made of meat! Laughing

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Rebel
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 8:18 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Having a finger on the pulse, I'd say no. I can name 2 debuts this year that were as good as anything we typically expect from veteran bands (Gloryhammer and Nautiluz), 4 albums from Veterans of tremendous quality (Stratovarius, Avantasia, Helloween and Dark Moor), and then a heap of younger bands that are all worth listening to (Judicator, Mind Maze, Project Roenwolfe).

Not to mention, there's still a Keldian album on the horizon for the year.

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icecab21
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 8:24 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

he was not talking about whether or not you like a album.

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Rebel
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 8:27 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

icecab21 wrote:
he was not talking about whether or not you like a album.

No, but he is restricting the terms to a number of old power metal bands when there are plenty of newer bands that are on the rise.

I do think that as the genre has matured, the focus has shifted from a small number of huge bands, to a larger number of more moderate sized fanbases.

http://www.google.com/trends/explore? q=stratovarius#q=power%20metal&cmpt=q
This shows a more moderate level of decline, and I think you also have to figure in search engine diffusion over time. While Google is still the majority shareholder in searches, as time has gone on, other search options have popularized.

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icecab21
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 8:30 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Nautiluz is just a flat purple line at the bottom compared to the rest of them. noone knows who they are as far as google search. gloryhole has a tiny bump then flatlines at the bottom

http://www.google.com/trends/explore? q=stratovarius#q=stratovarius%2C% 20sonata%20arctica%2C%20blind% 20guardian%2C%20Nautiluz%2C% 20Gloryhammer&cmpt=q

if you have a new band, doing bigger headline tours, that can be more of a indicator. looks like gloryhammer has a headline tour, could not find one for nautiluz.
although gloryhammer is from the alestorm guy so so that gives it a bit of a start on other new bands

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Rebel
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 9:00 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

icecab21 wrote:
Nautiluz is just a flat purple line at the bottom compared to the rest of them. noone knows who they are as far as google search. gloryhole has a tiny bump then flatlines at the bottom

http://www.google.com/trends/explore? q=stratovarius#q=stratovarius%2C% 20sonata%20arctica%2C%20blind% 20guardian%2C%20Nautiluz%2C% 20Gloryhammer&cmpt=q

if you have a new band, doing bigger headline tours, that can be more of a indicator. looks like gloryhammer has a headline tour, could not find one for nautiluz

As far as newer bands taking hold, look at say, Sabaton and Avantasia.

There are problems with google search trends that I'm confirming through other means. http://www.google.com/trends/explore? q=stratovarius#q=Power%20Metal&cmpt=q
Power Metal appears to be on a relative downward trend
http://www.google.com/trends/explore? q=stratovarius#q=Heavy%20Metal&cmpt=q
Heavy Metal, on the other hand, looks to be on an even LARGER downward trend.
http://www.google.com/trends/explore? q=stratovarius#q=Rap%20Music&cmpt=q Is Rap music dying too?
http://www.google.com/trends/explore? q=stratovarius#q=Folk%20Rock&cmpt=q Hipsters have created a resurgance of folk rock, but we're seeing a downward trend there too.

Now, it's possible that as a society, we're just less interested, however I think much more relevant, is the rise of facebook and other social networking, which has become a more effective means for gathering information than google. If you watch social networking groups about metal and power metal (As I do), then you'd see that Gloryhammer is a really big deal.

You could also look at the economics of the issue, but if you want information specific to power metal, you'd have to look at it against the context overall worldwide economic difficulties. I don't have that information ready at hand, especially in context with my earlier theory, but I /can/ say that there are still a TON of power metal albums being made. Here's some data from metal archives into the total amount of power metal being produced. The first number is the total releases (Singles, EP, live albums, box sets, ect...) and in parenthesis is the full length albums.

2005: 543 (264)
2006: 559 (276)
2007: 584 (291)
2008: 668 (341)
2009: 650 (347)
2010: 595 (334)
2011: 655 (359)
2012: 716 (419)
2013: 413 (256) (as of yet)

I could probably ask some record company people too. Lance King (President of Nightmare Records) in particular comes to mind as someone who would have a good perspective of the economics of this

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icecab21
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 9:14 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

it would be cool to get some of the economics on this.

i think it's definitely a case of people just not using Google and using other means. luca turilli's rhapsody gets some big tour production but hardly any google search.

would be interesting to see what the labels think of spotify.

https://play.spotify.com/artist/ 7dkEByOe0oHqc54qU4hwzV
gloryhammer has lots of views here.

looking more into gloryhammer, great singer and with the alestorm guy and nuclear blast, seems made safe to be successful with the cheeky songs and image.

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JensJohansson
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:07 pm    Post subject: Re: is "power metal" dying? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

AAAAAAAAAA wrote:
Click

Google trends, which reports search volume, seems to suggest yes. Wonder if our favorite bands are going to throw in the towel one of these days...

Discuss!


You're doing it wrong, click here Laughing

This seems to suggest power metal is doing great, at least every October...

Anyway it seems from that chart that the volume of searches in general decline... maybe many people just stay within Facebook and type in that search box?

Donno ..

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Rebel
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:09 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

icecab21 wrote:
it would be cool to get some of the economics on this.

i think it's definitely a case of people just not using Google and using other means. luca turilli's rhapsody gets some big tour production but hardly any google search.

would be interesting to see what the labels think of spotify.

https://play.spotify.com/artist/ 7dkEByOe0oHqc54qU4hwzV
gloryhammer has lots of views here.

looking more into gloryhammer, great singer and with the alestorm guy and nuclear blast, seems made safe to be successful with the cheeky songs and image.
Song title: The Unicorn Invasion of Dundee

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JensJohansson
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:13 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Rebel wrote:

http://www.google.com/trends/explore? q=stratovarius#q=Rap%20Music&cmpt=q Is Rap music dying too?


Please... yes

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NeverendingAbyss
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 12:06 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

What the hell is up with Indonesia? How did metal become popular there?

My thought was that Japan was the Asian center of metal. Is anime really taking over people's mind there?

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AAAAAAAAAA
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 6:44 am    Post subject: Re: is "power metal" dying? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

JensJohansson wrote:

Anyway it seems from that chart that the volume of searches in general decline... maybe many people just stay within Facebook and type in that search box?

Donno ..


Meh you're probably right. Google Trends seems to suggest that music itself is in decline, which is unlikely.

click

Also, searches for penis have gone up (no pun intended):

click

I expect this is because searching it in the Facebook search bar is not a realistic option...

Your theory is haphazardly confirmed!

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JensJohansson
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 9:55 am    Post subject: Re: is "power metal" dying? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

AAAAAAAAAA wrote:

Meh you're probably right. Google Trends seems to suggest that music itself is in decline, which is unlikely.

click

Also, searches for penis have gone up (no pun intended):

click

I expect this is because searching it in the Facebook search bar is not a realistic option...

Your theory is haphazardly confirmed!


I wonder in which situations people would search for "music".. or if google somehow counts searches for "really good music" also as just "music".

In other news, comebacks sometimes do occur.

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icecab21
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 11:26 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

the other peaks are at album releases
may 2009 is a peak, stratovarius album release
january 2011 is a peak, stratovarius album release
febuary 2013 is a peak, stratovarius album release

now in 2005 august was the peak, but the album came out in September, so that can show some other factors

http://www.google.com/trends/explore? q=sonata%20arctica%2C% 20sarin&cmpt=q#q=wacken%20open%20air%2C% 20Tuska%20%20open%20air&cmpt=q
with music festivals we can see tuska as the little baby of wacken
interesting that wacken gets the most interest during the month it happens while tuska gets the most interest before the festival happens

a interesting question for labels and bands could be what they are doing to keep interest between releases. perhaps the engagement is not going on at bands sites and third parties are making the money from fans engaging at places where neither the label or band make money from.

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JensJohansson
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 1:06 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

icecab21 wrote:

http://www.google.com/trends/explore? q=sonata%20arctica%2C% 20sarin&cmpt=q#q=wacken%20open%20air%2C% 20Tuska%20%20open%20air&cmpt=q
with music festivals we can see tuska as the little baby of wacken
interesting that wacken gets the most interest during the month it happens while tuska gets the most interest before the festival happens


I find the Tuska "Suvilahti" effect interesting (moved to different location in 2011 and after the first time in Suvilahti searches dropped pretty dramatically... )

BTW Wacken has about 10 times more people than Tuska

Regarding Wacken -- it's an outlier because it sells out long before all the bands have been announced. That's consumer trust.. people buy a ticket just knowing they will have a good time no matter who is playing really! They probably search for wacken in this spirit: "ok i already bought the ticket months ago.. i wonder who is playing then?"

whereas with Tuska it is "bleäögh, I really don't wanna go stand on the barren tarmac out in Suvlahti, but let me check if Stratovarius is playing this year... then maybe " Laughing

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Mormegil
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:11 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Rebel wrote:
I think much more relevant, is the rise of facebook and other social networking, which has become a more effective means for gathering information than google.

That's what I thought as well. There's really no need to google stuff about Stratovarius or Blind Guardian, since I get all the news I could hope for in my FB feed almost instantly.

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icecab21
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 1:17 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

http://www.socialbakers.com/facebook- pages/20648796656-stratovarius
this page shows that Mexicans really like Facebook.
is Mexico City a great place for shows?

is the growth in Facebook likes giving any significant meaning, seems all the bands i checked grow a lot, but are they making any money from this?

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Southern_Cross
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:45 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

All I can say is that power metal better not die.

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Rebel
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 11:21 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

JensJohansson wrote:
icecab21 wrote:

http://www.google.com/trends/explore? q=sonata%20arctica%2C% 20sarin&cmpt=q#q=wacken%20open%20air%2C% 20Tuska%20%20open%20air&cmpt=q
with music festivals we can see tuska as the little baby of wacken
interesting that wacken gets the most interest during the month it happens while tuska gets the most interest before the festival happens


I find the Tuska "Suvilahti" effect interesting (moved to different location in 2011 and after the first time in Suvilahti searches dropped pretty dramatically... )

BTW Wacken has about 10 times more people than Tuska

Regarding Wacken -- it's an outlier because it sells out long before all the bands have been announced. That's consumer trust.. people buy a ticket just knowing they will have a good time no matter who is playing really! They probably search for wacken in this spirit: "ok i already bought the ticket months ago.. i wonder who is playing then?"

whereas with Tuska it is "bleäögh, I really don't wanna go stand on the barren tarmac out in Suvlahti, but let me check if Stratovarius is playing this year... then maybe " Laughing
Laughing Laughing Have you been informed that you're a necessary component of the festival by a promoter or something? Laughing Laughing

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thefreeone
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:12 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

icecab21 wrote:
with this i found that britney spears episode in 2007 was more popular than miley cryrus 2013 episode.
both those were more popular in search than Adele and she has outsold both of them



if TT had known this in 2003 no stunt would have been made, right?

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Rebel
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 3:00 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

thefreeone wrote:
icecab21 wrote:
with this i found that britney spears episode in 2007 was more popular than miley cryrus 2013 episode.
both those were more popular in search than Adele and she has outsold both of them



if TT had known this in 2003 no stunt would have been made, right?
Probably still would have happened

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NeonVomit
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 12:26 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

I don't think power metal is going anywhere.

Power metal is pretty constant - it doesn't really have peaks or troughs like other genres. Like, black metal got hugely popular for a while now it's sort of settled down, there was a thrash revival for a while and it's settled back down, and so forth. Power metal I guess had a sort of spike when Dragonforce got their song on Guitar Hero, but it was more about them getting popular for a while as opposed to the genre as a whole.

I guess as bands try more things and mix genres around finding 'pure' power metal might be a bit more difficult but the bands are out there and are still playing it. The really big bands (Sonata Arctica, Strato, Blind Guardian etc.) might dabble in other styles but aside from that I think power metal is fine, just lurking below the surface and that's a good place.

Just as some people inexplicably 'grow out of it' (I've heard that phrase more than a couple of times) it's a very popular genre with younger listeners, as it tends to be pretty accessible, catchy and often deals with 'nerdy' themes like fantasy novels, dragons, science fiction and so on, which are actually growing in popularity around the world. Of course not all bands are like this, Mystic Prophecy being a prime example, but even they manage to attract listeners who wouldn't normally like power metal - I know more than a few thrash metallers who have really gotten into them because of their more aggressive approach.

As a result you have 'newer' bands like Powerwolf (they've been at it for a decade now, but you get what I mean) who are becoming really popular and it's not just because of their stage gimmicks - their songs are actually really cool and they don't take themselves too seriously which is very refreshing. I'm sure others can mention rising power metal acts.

I mean... 'Unbreakable' reminds me of an anime theme song and friends of mine who've heard it in my car have almost all said the same thing, especially the ones who watch a lot of anime. I don't think this is accidental, it speaks to a large market and as a result I'm pretty sure some people who like anime will end up listening to Stratovarius as a result. As an example of what a tiny link like that can do, I got into Stratovarius because of the classical elements back when I was in high school and really wanted to hear classical and metal being mixed, and almost 15 years later here I am...

So in conclusion, no, power metal is doing just fine. Just because google searches are (or aren't?) down doesn't mean people aren't going to gigs or getting their hands on the songs. And that is good for all of us.

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NeverendingAbyss
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 3:25 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

NeonVomit wrote:
'Unbreakable' reminds me of an anime theme song and friends of mine who've heard it in my car have almost all said the same thing, especially the ones who watch a lot of anime. I don't think this is accidental, it speaks to a large market and as a result I'm pretty sure some people who like anime will end up listening to Stratovarius as a result.


Oh, please don't let them come to this forum. The last thing we need are anime-loving fan base ruining this place. Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad

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NeonVomit
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 3:36 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Ruining this place?! This place is broken beyond repair already. Coming on here prepares me for a post-apocalyptic existence better than playing Fallout 3 ever will. It's survived a sock puppet pandemic, weapons-grade trolls, fascist extremists, full-blown rebellions, and has been demolished and rebuilt a number of times. A few anime fans won't really make a difference and besides, most of them will be horrified by what they see on their first few visits and never come on again as I suspect happens with most people. Of course, all of these are reasons I've liked this place all these years...

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NeverendingAbyss
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 3:41 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Laughing Which reminds me, whatever happened to Ragehead, Hiro, and even Robolol. He hasn't posted as much recently. Is he getting laid? Shocked

I still agree with Bathory. We need a couple of mods. Remember when this place was once an actual community? Remember when we used to have girls posting pics too?

Ahhh nostalgia... Embarassed

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NeonVomit
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 3:49 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

I think AAAAAAAAAA and a few others scared Hiro off. I think RoboLulz got more into his death metal thing, I don't think he's getting laid! Ragehead just slipped off the radar in general... there have been a few more casualties, sucked away from here by actually getting a life. I have a few choice individuals on Facebook (like NordicStorm and StratoPlayer), but other than that they have been lost in the sands of time.

A couple of mods might work but they'd have to be special individuals who would not go mad with power... as I seem to remember happened. I'd make a terrible moderator. And yes... I remember a time when girls would post pictures. But then of course there are no girls on the internet.

I think Jens would rather keep this place tightly within the grasp of the band itself because ultimately what gets posted on here might eventually find its way onto blabbermouth or other outlets.

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