Elements part1, worst album, except Fright Night ?

[Bryant]

I searched before I posted this, if someone before had posted a similar topic, so I´m very sure this discussion wasn`t led in the past.
I`m curious how all you guys think about Elements part1.
Personally I think it`s the worst except Fright night. Only "Eagleheart" and "Soul of a vagabund" are worth listen to, the rst is really bad. Koti sings in Learning to fly and Find your own voice much too high, and the hole thing sounds to "nice" and to "positive". Too much orchestra was used and some songs like "Fantasia", "Elements", Drop in the ocean or Stratofortress are really boring.
What do you think ?

[shaz]

My opinion is strictly opposite. I really like pt.1, and the fact that many people condemn it because it sounds too "happy" seems really weird to me.
Should all metal be solely just dark/gloomy stuff? I think not.
The sound is really rich throughout the album, and I even like the songs - all of them - pretty equally.
I think that even though it doesn't sound exactly the same as the material from the Episode/Visions/Destiny -era, it IS a fantastic cd.

BTW, I disagree with your claim that Drop in the ocean, Stratofortress, Elements, or Fantasia are boring.
'Drop in the ocean' is a really encouraging, positive track..
'Stratofortress', on the other hand, a cool instrumental with a tight song structure and a powerful feel to it.
Lyrically thinking, 'Elements' is a bit on the stranger side, yes.. but still a great package.
'Fantasia' is a happy song, yes. I still like it. Kotipelto's singing is especially worth mentioning here, he has a lot of power and still retains the usual positivity of the song.

[Sir. Decadence]

No, no.
Elements Pt. 1 is good album.
Better than Fright Night, yes, but also better than Twilight Time and Intermission.
It's as good as Infinite, I think.
Well, yes, not as good as Elements Pt. 2 (and the rest Strato-albums), but still good.
So, I like most Soul Of A Vagabond, it's amazing song.
Then comes Papillon, Fantasia, Elements, Find Your Own Voice and Learning to Fly (well, LTF's chorus is very similar with Helloween's March of Time's chorus..hrm...but still it's very good song).
I don't like so much A Drop In The Ocean, it's a little bit boring, that I have to agree.
And Eagleheart...well, it's so POP.
But it's still OK.
Stratofortress is not so good, but as good as Eagleheart I think, maybe even better.
So, that's my opinion.

[Twilightsymphony]

Well.. Infinite and Elements Pt.2 are the worst by far, imo...

Elements 1 is way better, actually i like it... Fright Night isnt bad either...

[Beast_Pete]

My "worst" stratoalbum is Twilight Time.

Elements Part I was my second album bought, and I love that album... I have many feelings and memories connecting to it. My fav song on the album is Learning to Fly. I hope to hear it one day. Elements was the best live perform on the concert (except Destiny/Fanatasia, which is my all time favourite live song).

[Veripalttu]

Elements pt1 is the best and the worst Stratovarius album, because it's so different. No Strato album has been that massive and that can make a HC- good old Stratofan think "dude, this sucks", but someone who has been waiting for a change, maybe even a big change loves it.
I feel the same way about Helloween's The dark ride, it's the best and the worst, because it is so different.

[Holy Light]

I think Elements Part 1 is a good album, but certainly not Strato's best. I think Kotipelto did an awesome job on the vocals. Some of the vocal parts are extremely hard to sing. The songs are good. I would like Stratovarius to include more guitar solos, like they used to. This is beacause Tolkki is a great player. I'd also like to hear more of Jens. Tolkki's solos used to be fucking awesome, you can tell he doesn't have the spirit he used to on his solos. The production of the album is the best in the metal scene.

[Bryant]

Thanks for all these replies.
But I stand to my oppinion, that Elements part1 is not very good. The sound is very good, I agree to that without hesitating. But the material, Stratofortress sounds boring. For me it seems Timo Tolkki had not a clue how to create another instrumental song. Compared to "Holy light" - which is GREAT - or "Stratosphere", "Requiem" or even "Atlantis" it`s not very exciting.
Someone wrote that some vocal parts are extremly difficult to sing. I think a vocalist should know his abilities and he should know what he can sing and what he can`t. I am a vocalist in my own band - not professionel of course - and I don`t sing in heights I couldn`t reach on stage. I`ve heard Koti live on the Elements part1-tour, in some songs he didn`t hit the tones. But, please don`t get me wrong, he is a good vocalist. His perfomance on "Visions of europe" or the few singles with livetracks he is incredibly good.
I don`t think metal has to be always dark - well, I like that, but I hasn`t has to be. But I think this Ep1-material is weak, not my thing. And Strato can`t show their strength and brilliance with these songs.
And - like one of you guys said - too few guitar solos.

[Beast_Pete]

Tolkki didn't have much time to write the songs. Nuclear Blast held a big pressure on his head.

[Turbonorsu]

I usually tend to think about Elements 1 the same way I think about helloweens "pink bubbles" or even "chameleon"...I mean they're great records, but their sound and athmosphere is so different from the other ones, that it would be unfair to compare them with those records (take "the dark ride", for example)...I mean, ELements 1 was a different strato album, and it has its own good and bad aspects, but I'd never compare it to visions or destiny, since it' s just so different.

All in all, I think it's an ok album. Not their best, but definitely not their worst, either! I'm still a bit pissed off, because "run away" didn't end up to the album, though. An excellent song!

[Twilightsymphony]

Whats wrong with the Album sounding different? I am pretty much bored by hearing Elements Pt2 (=Infinite) over and over. I was quite happy to see that Elements 1 had a different direction, i also like the lyrics as most of them are different from what we´ve heard before.

If the next strato record is something like E Pt.2 or Infinite again i wont buy it, there are so many albums of that kind out there already... imo, the whole melodic metal genre is quite stagnant atm...

[Turbonorsu]

Dude, absolutely nothing is wrong with that!

Actually both "pink bubbles" and "chameleon" are amongst my favourite albums...And they both got a lot of hate from Helloween fans, when they were published...

ANd I concur: I hope that the may-be-coming-out-sometime new stratovarius album wouldn't be like infinite...although I hope that it won't be like E1 either...well, there's nothing left to do but wait...

[Twilight Legionnaire]

Elements Pt. 1 is for Stratovarius what the X Factor and Virtual X are for Iron Maiden. This is -my- opinion.

And why do I say this? They're albums where both bands really took a big step in the dark, and it obviously surprised the oldschool fans. Some were quick to hate it, which is perfectly understandable- the old sound was the one that got them into the band in the first place; others really enjoyed it- a change of style (and also of vocals, on Maiden's case), a breeze of fresh air into the band is always welcome

In my opinion Elements Pt. 1 isn't that bad an album. Yes, I miss the solos, and yes, I hate it when the vocals are unable to reach the tone, or struggle so hard to reach it that it sounds awful. But I must say I do enjoy the new atmosphere of the songs, just like I liked Iron Maiden's transition to the "dark side" of songs.

[Electric Eye]

I don't think that any Stratovarius album is as different from the others that we could say it's definitely the worst one.

and why Fright Night? I think it is really interesting. Hear the rhythm in those songs, you won't find such patents or breaks (I don't know how to call it precisely) on other albums.

[MetalManiac]

Well, personally I think Fright Night is among the best albums Strato has ever produced.

But the Elements Pt. I... It is good, but worse than any other album (except Intermission). But of course, these are only my opinions.

[Fireblade]

My opinion is strictly opposite. I really like pt.1, and the fact that many people condemn it because it sounds too "happy" seems really weird to me.
Should all metal be solely just dark/gloomy stuff? I think not.
The sound is really rich throughout the album, and I even like the songs - all of them - pretty equally.
I think that even though it doesn't sound exactly the same as the material from the Episode/Visions/Destiny -era, it IS a fantastic cd.

BTW, I disagree with your claim that Drop in the ocean, Stratofortress, Elements, or Fantasia are boring.
'Drop in the ocean' is a really encouraging, positive track..
'Stratofortress', on the other hand, a cool instrumental with a tight song structure and a powerful feel to it.
Lyrically thinking, 'Elements' is a bit on the stranger side, yes.. but still a great package.
'Fantasia' is a happy song, yes. I still like it. Kotipelto's singing is especially worth mentioning here, he has a lot of power and still retains the usual positivity of the song.

I totally agree with this post!

I think the two Elements' are among the best they have ever done.

[Efenstor]

I don't like both Elements because they were written when Timo was already in the state of deep affect. I really don't like the blasphemous notes of "Hymn to Life" that can be heard there. I hate blasphemy. One should be really delusioned to call God "plastic". May be Timo was raised in a too devout family? You know all these "God will punish you!".

"No religion", well, why not; all religions are somewhat dangerous because they are the social organizations, but "no God" means "no World" for me. What God is for you all? For me it's not Christ, at least not Christ alone. Christ is the same piece of God as we all. Christ was just a truly believer man.

"In the seventeenth chapter of Saint Luke it is written "the kingdom of God is within man" - not one man, nor a group of men - but in all men - in you." These words were cited in "Hymn of Life" and there I also hear "Do you hear me, you f..ck!". Seems that there were too much illusions then in the Timo's view of the world and in his attitude to God. I know what it means when you don't know what do you feel and think, when mess is everywhere. And when I feel so, I go to the forest. To the real temple build by the God/Life/Nature him/her/itself.

I think many of us would fall into the same illustions as Tolkki did if the same has happened in their lives. Though if something happens, there is a reason. Or no reason at all, but still we can make some inferences out of it.

[cliff]

Personally I think it`s the worst except Fright night. Only "Eagleheart" and "Soul of a vagabund" are worth listen to, the rst is really bad. Koti sings in Learning to fly and Find your own voice much too high, and the hole thing sounds to "nice" and to "positive". Too much orchestra was used and some songs like "Fantasia", "Elements", Drop in the ocean or Stratofortress are really boring.
What do you think ?

I think Fright Night is actually a "ok" album who could have been good with a better production.
I do agree with everything u wrote. "Elements part I" is the worst Strato album. Too much orchestra effects can never replace poor basis of a song.
Honestly, I don't find any interesting song in that album. "Find Your Own Voice" could be great if Timo sang it one octaver lower. "Papillon" is the most awful ballad that Tolkki has composed so far. "Drop In The Ocean" chorus is actually quite good. "Eagleheart" is really annoying.
I'm not a fan of "Soul Of A Vagabond" myself. good symphonic arrangement but crap vocal lines.
"Elements Part II" is much better in my opinion.

[fifthtea_sausage]

ELEMENTS I IS AWESOME!
How can you not like the song "elements?'
That with eagleheart is enough to make me buy the album

[Lobo_]

I think that a very important issue in this discusion is when did we start to listen to stratovarius. I mean was Elements 1 the first album you heard, the second, the last one? many people I know who just started listening to strato liked very much Elements part 1. But many others who had all the previous strato experience and were expecting a superb album, afert a long break, were really disapointed (myself included). My fav album is Destiny and although I may accept that Episode and Vision are "better" I still like destiny so much because It was the first Strato album I listened to.
I feel both elements are boring compared to the previous material. I don't know why many people say this album is completely different. It is pretty much he same, with many backing/leading orchestra, but the structures are the same, the ideas are basically similar but without taste. It is same old Joe with a new hat and an anoying smile.

[Jack The Ripper]

I believe that elements pt1 is a good cd.Not their best but a really good one...Some of the songs are happy(Eagleheart,learning to fly) but i cannot understand why this for some people isa bad thing...This cd has some great songs(Eagleheart,S O U L O F A V A G A B O N D,Elements)...I haven't heard fright night so in my opinion their worst album is Elements pt2..........

[Twilightsymphony]

What God is for you all?

"one of my favourite sci-fi characters"

I liked the lyrics of elements 1... they are partially quite an expression of what i think... especially the song Elements.

[browneyedgirl]

I liked the symphonic emphasis in Elements I, especially in SOAV&Elements. Its not my favorite Strato Album, of course&I like Elements II better, but Elements I is a good piece of work-----the 2 Elements recordings harmonize together very nicely, IMO!


And, yes, those of us ultra-sensitive people could tell Tolkki's mood was on a downhill slide based on the words/lyrics&general composition of the music compared with other albums. He was becoming confused within himself&questioning things around him&within. TT was sending clear signals of his emotional distress.......

[Bryant]

Okay, I see that I´m almost alone with my oppinion that Elements part1 is not very good. I didn`t expect something else, I knew most of you would disagree with me, that`s okay.
I noticed that lots of you had a problem with my term "some songs are to nice and happy". I try to explain.
My first Strato-album was Infinite, one of their greatest, I think. Then I got Destiny, then Episode, then Visions, then the older ones. When I listened to Elements part1 I was - you could say - shoecked to here an accordion - I don`t if this is the real name for this instrument in english - in Fantasia, in the part where this childish voice could be heard, right before it`s getting harder again. And "Learning to fly" sounds ... old, nothing new or interesing on this one. Would it has been on Episode it would be a great song, so it sounds like Timo needed one song more and wrote this very quick to fill in a blank.
And I said this album is boring because I think Strato is a band which isn`t made to work in that way with a big orchestra. They can´t show their real strength and capabilities.
In Elements part2 there is less orchestra and - except Alpha and omega and Know the difference - it`s a great CD.
Hope I made myself a little bit clearer.

[MaFiaBoY]

And, yes, those of us ultra-sensitive people could tell Tolkki's mood was on a downhill slide based on the words/lyrics&general composition of the music compared with other albums. He was becoming confused within himself&questioning things around him&within. TT was sending clear signals of his emotional distress.......

No need to be "ultra-sensitive" to understand this.... Anyway I like E1 very much, for all the reasons some other told they DIDN'T like it It's in my top3 strato albums along with Visions & Episode.

[shaz]

What God is for you all?

Something/someone that is as real as any character described in a fictitious book.
I mean, I feel uncomfortable if I try to imagine relying on god, or something like that.
I see god as an imaginary figure just like for example Bilbo Baggins from the lord of the rings etc.
It's just that the book where God is featured in was written so long ago, and by so many people that we cannot prove it to be false because of the lack of proof.
An uh.. it's not like God is going to do anything for me if i'm in trouble. I've got to take care of myself, and not just pray or whatever.
I just found this question so intriguing that I had to state my opinion, so sry for the off-topic.

[Equinox]

There is not a bad strato album. IMO of course.....

And it just doesn't matter if E1 is too positive......and if u are lookinf for negativity u should listen some death metal then, but do not say that E1 was bad.

[So Death May Die]

There is not a bad strato album. IMO of course.....

And it just doesn't matter if E1 is too positive......and if u are lookinf for negativity u should listen some death metal then, but do not say that E1 was bad.

QFT

I've always held the belief that all of the albums are extremely good. My personal tastes may draw toward some albums more than others, but I enjoy all of them very much. The music is superb.

I see way too many people flaming Stratofortress in this thread. Sure it may not be as long and drawn out as Holy Light or Stratosphere, but the musicianship on Stratofortress is equal to the other instrumentals if not better in some ways. The technicality of recording the last minute or so with the drum hits and rolls is very difficult to do (and quite unique sounding for this song). The fast part in the middle with the harmonized keys and guitars sounds a lot like Stratosphere, but the key is that it's nowhere near as drawn out sounding. It's a matter of musical choice when composing the song... I think Tolkki knew that he wanted Stratofortress to be fast and short. He wanted an instrumental that would hit you with extreme ferocity and technicality, without letting it drag on longer than it should and thus take away from the album as a whole. See also Sonata Arctica's Revontulet for a similar example.

[Sknight2112]

I think Elemt. pt 1 is great, of course its the only album of theirs I have...
I agre eagleheart is one of the best but I really like all of the tracks. I love Stratofortress, it reminds me of all the games I liked on the Nintendo Entertainment System, since they all had pretty much the same soundtrack.

[fifthtea_sausage]

1. There is nothing wrong with appy songs. When I want to lsiten to music I want to feel happy and good, not depressed and bad.

2. I just might want to comment here - the part of the accordian in fantasia is probably my favorite strato moment of all time. When I listen to it I feel something really weird inside - from the simplicity of the accordian...