Stratovarius Community

Demir wrote:

Verdades Parias wrote:I think that was not an act of generosity, but of relief. Nor do I believe that deserves a tremendous thank you, because nobody asked him what he did. Even requests that he not be given anything of the royalties from his catalog. And that has not been asked, then, I think that Tolkki completely released the rope, to continue with his life. And the rest of the group, can do what they apparently want to do, continue as Stratovarius. As many fans also want
From my part, I think that may be more original and better (I hope), what Stratovarius can do without Tolkki, as something fresh, different and powerful, that the classical Tolkkish song, which I love, but I always waited for something different, new and non-repetitive

He just want to look generous and more like a martyr with this. He has to leave behind the band if they have all that debt. No matter how he puts it, he still got the RR money and the other guys are broke cause of what he did.

Sorry but i believe that giving any and all royalties from past and future stratovarius releases is indeed generous and i think that it will very quickly eliminate any and all debt that the remaining members have and will ever have

Hum, I have to say I was pretty surprised by Tolkki's attitude...
I agree with the post above: he wanted to be generous and also feel like a martyr.

I just don't understand why he doesn't want to have any money from the Stratovarius back-catalogue sales...
I know he wanted to end up with everything to have his mind clear to work on RR; that's a nice reason.

But didn't he work on all those albuns, giving his time, sweat and blood in order to create all that stuff?
That's a fair thing to receive something back from his creativity; he does deserve it.

It's the same example of any of us working hard and under the sun and rain during a whole day and in the end give our salary to someone else...

Anyway, after listening to RR I must confess I expected much more from it...
I didn't feel the power the Stratovarius albums contain; but that's just my opinion.

A good example is Last Night On Earth that, even considering Kiske as a wonderful singer, was WAY better with Kotipelto on vocals, as we all saw on that live video.

I just liked 4 of all those songs:
Heroes
I Did It My Way
Last Night On Earth
Revolution Renaissance

All in all I will keep on following his songs on RR and put all my hopes now on the 3 remaining members of Stratovarius which is such an important band to me!

Peace!

Am I wrong or does TT says between the lines that this shit with Mrs K was publicity shit ?

Wow now he's been called a martyr!? If he wanted to look like a martyr he wouldn't have done it at such a high price I mean, he's giving up the rights for more than 120 songs that, let's face it, made Stratovarius what it is today.

Many guys argue that Tolkki wasn't an original member of the band, which he wasn't, but the band without him would have been catalogued as 'also ran', their songs are TOTALLY different from what Tolkki started writing and their success was all because of him. Maybe you can't stand him for whatever reason, but he must get credit for all that he did with the band.

I think the other guys can make a cool power metal band, but nothing like Stratovarius, as he said, Strato is not only about the power metal, it is about the message that is given throughout the songs and lyrics.
Unfortunately that message was something that just Tolkki was able to deliver, no one in the band cares about that message anymore and that's what will make the new strato just a good power metal band with no message whatsoever

That's right. No matter what mistakes TT made in the past, and how strange he sometimes behaved, the "message" of Stratovarius, the lyrics, the philosophy, cannot be replaced.
And although I still don't concider myself to belong more to one "side" (remaining Stratovarius-members vs. TT), I somehow think, or better feel, that TT is the one that is talking openly here. The statement of the remaining 4 sounded more business-like, more like reckoning. Maybe Tolkki lied on some points, I cannot know, but on many points he is definitely right. The step to renounce all rights, the name, the backkatalogues etc is very impressive. I wonder what all those people think now that called im a lying asshole and stuff like that.
Maybe he also wants to appear a little bit like a martyr, who knows, to wash himself clean. But even if so - why not? To me it only shows that he definitely has decided to go on with his life, with his music. There is no turning back anymore. And somehow I can comprehend this feeling, to be free from an incriminating past.
TT will go his way, and obviously from now on he goes it with decency. Hopefully the other guys will do the same and renounce the name Stratovarius as well. For me this would be the only way of the 4 how they can stay credible.

I hope that now they have all the rights to the name they release the promised DVD recorded live in São Paulo. That concert was great.

Egalmoth wrote:I hope that now they have all the rights to the name they release the promised DVD recorded live in São Paulo. That concert was great.

Tolkki stated often enough that the quality was too bad. There will never be such a live DVD.

stratohawk wrote:

Egalmoth wrote:I hope that now they have all the rights to the name they release the promised DVD recorded live in São Paulo. That concert was great.

Tolkki stated often enough that the quality was too bad. There will never be such a live DVD.

And do you believe him?
I doubt it was that bad, probably it's just his opinion. If Iced Earth has relaesed the Alive in Athens DVD I don't see why they shouldn't release that DVD.

Well, I don't have time to read the whole new Tolkki's announcement, so I just skimmed through it.

The only thing that came into my mind is: there was "Stratovarius" before Tolkki came to the band...and the band was different, played different music than "classical" 1990s' Stratovarius...

My memories go back to the year 1984 when I received that phone call to join Stratovarius when the guitar player/ main songwriter had been fired

...guitar player/main songwriter had been fired and the band had changed and continued under same name. Of course it's much different situation - unknown band of 1984 versus Stratovarius of these days. But on the other hand...guitar player/main songwriter was fired and the band contiued with the new one - TT, he changed the band completely and later fired all the remaining original members. Right now he broke up the band (and in fact fired himself) and tries to take control over that what's going on?? Why shouldn't they use the Stratovarius name? If they will, they will do the same thing as TT did in the past. Yeah, maybe I shouldn't compare those situations, but they're really similar. TT in fact left the band now. OK, he doesn't want to continue with them, so he can go. Nobody is irreplaceable, even Tolkki is not. Of course it will be different band, but this happens sometimes. And above all - who did left the band??

Btw. who said that TT has rights to Stratovarius name? Somebody's lying and it makes me feel that it's not the only lie

black death wrote: Somebody's lying and it makes me feel that it's not the only lie

Tolkki has been lying about everything. Saana master stolen, Jari Jokinen, Miss K, leaked Saana songs, Revolution Renaissance contract, breakup of Stratovarius, firing himself from Stratovarius .... I think he's very confused by now

black death wrote:Well, I don't have time to read the whole new Tolkki's announcement, so I just skimmed through it.

The only thing that came into my mind is: there was "Stratovarius" before Tolkki came to the band...and the band was different, played different music than "classical" 1990s' Stratovarius...

My memories go back to the year 1984 when I received that phone call to join Stratovarius when the guitar player/ main songwriter had been fired

...guitar player/main songwriter had been fired and the band had changed and continued under same name. Of course it's much different situation - unknown band of 1984 versus Stratovarius of these days. But on the other hand...guitar player/main songwriter was fired and the band contiued with the new one - TT, he changed the band completely and later fired all the remaining original members. Right now he broke up the band (and in fact fired himself) and tries to take control over that what's going on?? Why shouldn't they use the Stratovarius name? If they will, they will do the same thing as TT did in the past. Yeah, maybe I shouldn't compare those situations, but they're really similar. TT in fact left the band now. OK, he doesn't want to continue with them, so he can go. Nobody is irreplaceable, even Tolkki is not. Of course it will be different band, but this happens sometimes. And above all - who did left the band??

Btw. who said that TT has rights to Stratovarius name? Somebody's lying and it makes me feel that it's not the only lie

+5
Black death, you have guts!

He is not trying to take over control. Read his statement. He just let everything go. He gave away all the rights, which he owned.

first off brown"eye" girl is a moron , second off i really hope this is a last statement cause anymore of this is slaughtering everyone in the bands respect.

Egalmoth wrote:

stratohawk wrote:

Egalmoth wrote:I hope that now they have all the rights to the name they release the promised DVD recorded live in São Paulo. That concert was great.

Tolkki stated often enough that the quality was too bad. There will never be such a live DVD.

And do you believe him?
I doubt it was that bad, probably it's just his opinion. If Iced Earth has relaesed the Alive in Athens DVD I don't see why they shouldn't release that DVD.

I not believe it was that bad, either. "Infinite Visions" was amateurishly done, and that was its charm! IV was a cool video! I hope the Sao Paulo production is released someday, too.

@killedbyDETH, I did NOT make that post, IDIOT. I simply agreed with HER post because Black Death told the unbiased truth. Shes's not a blindfollower like some people are. Can't you accept her opinion, and that others may not agree with YOU?
Black Death DOES have guts&it was proven by your reaction to MY agreement to her post. You did not have the guts to reply to her, though, did ya?

Pel0nman wrote:Unfortunately that message was something that just Tolkki was able to deliver, no one in the band cares about that message anymore and that's what will make the new strato just a good power metal band with no message whatsoever

I totally disagree with that, Jens wrote one amazing song called glory of the world....yes, it's just one, but compared to Tolkki, is at the same level...He can do it!

black death wrote:Btw. who said that TT has rights to Stratovarius name? Somebody's lying..

Ehm, would you describe more what do you think with this? Do you mean the rights of the name belongs to the whole band or still Tuomo Lassila instead? Well we don´t know the truth, that´s the only sure part.

browneyedgirl wrote:

Egalmoth wrote:

stratohawk wrote:

Egalmoth wrote:I hope that now they have all the rights to the name they release the promised DVD recorded live in São Paulo. That concert was great.

Tolkki stated often enough that the quality was too bad. There will never be such a live DVD.

And do you believe him?
I doubt it was that bad, probably it's just his opinion. If Iced Earth has relaesed the Alive in Athens DVD I don't see why they shouldn't release that DVD.

I not believe it was that bad, either. "Infinite Visions" was amateurishly done, and that was its charm! IV was a cool video! I hope the Sao Paulo production is released someday, too.

That's true. "Infinite Visions" had its charm. Well, but what I expected from the live DVD was a recording in good quality from a good concert. And after they delayed the release about years, personally I see no other reason for that than the bad quality. Yes, there might be other reasons we are not told about, but at least this explanation seems plausible to mee. When you watch a band live you often think "Wooohow, what an amazing show!!", and when you see/hear a recording of that show later you cannot imagine that it was one and the same.

Shes's not a blindfollower like some people are.

I guess in your opinion those "blindfollowers" are the ones that also believe parts of what TT wrote, right? Well I see three parties in this forum: One is truly believing what Tolkki is saying, another that follows the statement of the remaining 4 members, and then there are those that try to get a preferably neutral view on what is happening. You should not make the mistake to call everyone a blindfollower that is also trying to include TTs statements.
[I don't condemn one side, and of course I'm not defending mannerless posts like that from Killedbydeth. But if you or anyone else is taking part simply against Tolkki, it's the same blindfollowing as you charge.]

Well, while everyone(myself included)has gone on&on about how "kind" Tolkki is in letting the guys use the Stratovarius name, I have since learned this will be a two-edged sword. The guys will inherit all the debts, which are not small to say the least. So, how really "kind" is Tolkki?

browneyedgirl wrote:Well, while everyone(myself included)has gone on&on about how "kind" Tolkki is in letting the guys use the Stratovarius name, I have since learned this will be a two-edged sword. The guys will inherit all the debts, which are not small to say the least. So, how really "kind" is Tolkki?

Well but they are not committed to anything. They can do whatever they want.

*sigh*

It would really be the best thing for everybody to leave Stratovarius RIP and continue from a fresh start on.

stratohawk wrote:

browneyedgirl wrote:Well, while everyone(myself included)has gone on&on about how "kind" Tolkki is in letting the guys use the Stratovarius name, I have since learned this will be a two-edged sword. The guys will inherit all the debts, which are not small to say the least. So, how really "kind" is Tolkki?

Well but they are not committed to anything. They can do whatever they want.

*sigh*

It would really be the best thing for everybody to leave Stratovarius RIP and continue from a fresh start on.

I make one exception to comment this by saying that I am responsible for 1/4 of the legal costs despite of giving away the rights since the lawsuit was ongoing before that. From the back catalogue sales/merch/DVDs etc I am sure the guys will get more than enough money.

browneyedgirl wrote:Well, while everyone(myself included)has gone on&on about how "kind" Tolkki is in letting the guys use the Stratovarius name, I have since learned this will be a two-edged sword. The guys will inherit all the debts, which are not small to say the least. So, how really "kind" is Tolkki?

Let me entitle your posts: "The fine line between love and hate"

valo_666 wrote:

browneyedgirl wrote:Well, while everyone(myself included)has gone on&on about how "kind" Tolkki is in letting the guys use the Stratovarius name, I have since learned this will be a two-edged sword. The guys will inherit all the debts, which are not small to say the least. So, how really "kind" is Tolkki?

Let me entitle your posts: "The fine line between love and hate"

Let me entitle YOUR posts,"the fine line between genius and insanity----only without the genius."

.........As we saaaaaiiiil awaaaaaay, moonstruck and astray
.........We're faaaaalleeeeeen aaaaangeeeeels.........

.........We're the scary tale to scare your mind away
...........................From faaaaaalleeeen aaaaangeeeeeels

valo_666 wrote: Let me entitle your posts: "The fine line between love and hate"

The THIN line between love and hate (Maiden fans will understand me)

The rights to the name Stratovarius is not the same as the contract to Sanctuary. The contract to Sanctuary was signed by the 5 members of Stratovarius in 2003, and it seems that now 4 of them are still in contract with that label, Jari was released, while Lauri is not obliged to obey that contract. Releasing the rights of Stratovarius is not equal with giving the debts to the others.

There is something weird about that statement and I see it now, and this is just an example. This is narcissism in action, Tolkki can't understand anything unless he thinks of it in the context of himself and his self image.

Tolkki statement wrote:I really don’t understand the whole statement in any other way than cleverly putting all the blame on me and trying to destroy my new career, while continuing under the name ”Stratovarius”

The facts in this story are much different from what he wrote before. The common thread in both is how the other guys failed him over the years. But even with all these many words he avoids if he signed the R.R. deal before or after telling the rest. It may been long before, but this statement is closest to an admission of guilt and regret there will ever be.

try to think about what Tolkki or other 4 members can think when they're reading this chat, only they know, where is thruth a we fans are trying to solve this.. i think i understand tolkki...but it's no problem...
my opininon is that remainings members would not use the name Stratovarius because Tolkki was the heart of this band....but again that's no problem...i think that remainings members will not even play together, Kotipelto has his solo band, Michael works in some production agency? or what Tolkki wrote in first statement...in my view the one from them who can compose good music is Kotipelto, but it's really different from Strato music...but let it us a surprise
and the last thing, first i saw Infinite Visions, i was fascinated watching this band, these friends and great musicians and great live..but it's possible that it all just seemed in tv screen, i can see it in my own band, we are all friends, "friends", but the one or two members are drafters and they often imagine a little different behaviour from others...in this case i understand to Tolkki, i think it all could bee seen on tours and gigs
g n

Timo...with this last staement you cleared lots of things, but also new questions poped out..

with the supossition that all what you wrote is 100%true, all i can say is that you are a kind person, i respect that you are trying to forget the past and start again, fresh and new.

its just so sad, for us, for you, for the band members, all this situation...
i wish you guys could have ended in a different way, shake hands and forgive each others mistakes, its not late...

To say the truth I myself have given up trying to understand things.
I have given up trying to take sides and to say "he's wrong" or he's right".

Now we have to bands: Revolution Renaissance and the other guys band, Stratovarius or whatever...

I, as a fan of them, will buy both cds, period.
There's no need to wonder too much about it anymore.

It will not make me any better and I will get inside a labyrinth from which I will never be able to find the way out, 'cause the real meaning of all the problem is only inside of their minds and this is out of reach for any of us.

So the real wisdom is: Accept the fact, face reality and buy both cds.

brunodargor wrote:To say the truth I myself have given up trying to understand things.
I have given up trying to take sides and to say "he's wrong" or he's right".

A wise decision.