Difficult question: The worst strato song(s) for you

[Sumerian]

Anything from Polaris and Elysium. The difference in quality from Tolkki era is quite obvious. Even the artwork is shit now. From dolphin to pelican. That symbolizes the changes of this band.

As always, I just state my opinion...

[eternity_strato]

I so expected that.

[robocop656]

From dolphin to pelican, Sumerian is back.

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[eternity_strato]

From dolphin to pelican, Sumerian is back.

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[browneyedgirl]

What about Platypus?

[browneyedgirl]

Thin Ice. Never got its psychedelic feel. Too artistic? The actual music tracks are all better. I like this thing in, say, Aphrodite's Child, but I think it's really off-the-mark in a Strato album. Also, Magic Carpet Ride is a watered-down version from Rainbow - Gates of Babylon, in my opinion. Not too similar but muuuuch worse, and one of the worst Strato tracks.

FullMoon. I guess pretty much the same as above. Not their style.

Which makes me list some newer songs: The Game Never Ends, Move the Mountain, Event Horizon. What is dis, some nu-prog? Not Stratovarius for me anymore. Somehow Precious and Fairness Justified are these semi-prog long cyrup ballads that are something like Cain's Offering, so I don't feel at home with them, either.

(Basically Elysium has been the first album for me that doesn't feel like Stratovarius anymore. Even the Strato-ish songs like Infernal Maze and Under Flaming Skies are somehow dull, stretched... Where's the passion and energy in them there once was?)

A Million Light Years Away. I've gotten bored of it. I've always heard it live. A commercial song that really can't take intensive amount of listening, like all the other Infinite songs can. At least for me.

Will the Sun Rise? Definitely my least favorite from my favorite Strato album. Would be flawless if this song was better.

030366. Queensrÿche - Screaming in Digital clone. There are actually many things in Stratovarius' music that are straight from QR (and many other bands as well). Child of Fire: "Look around / Is this the end you've foreseen?" <-> Fright Night: "Look around / Is this the end you see?". And Falling into Fantasy is very similar to The Lady Wore Black. Not all the songs stand on their own, but are too close to already existing songs. (Fright Night of course more notably towards Helloween's Halloween).

030366 is a part of the weakest line of Strato songs, in my opinion. This lasts about from Winter to Nightfall (hah). All those songs in between are left kind of distant to me. Winter and Nightfall, for example, are both beautiful but... I don't know. They lack their own identity or so? Easy to forget those two. The rest in between aren't that good at all. Lord of the Wasteland a bit too basic power metal track, like We Are the Future but much, much worse and impersonal. Somehow Stratovarius is my least liked instrumental from them as well... I'm also not a fan of Distant Skies. I'm not that much into lyrics per se, but this is ridiculous. As is I Walk to My Own Song. o_O Also one of my least favorite Strato songs ever. Tolkki's cheapest "hit format song", which is saying something...

Gypsy in Me feels most like a filler on Stratovarius the album. I actually like the rest a lot! Undecided with Leave the Tribe though; nothing special.

Keep the Flame Alive, if you can count the RR demo with Strato line-up. A Tale That Wasn't Right, anyone? A great example of Tolkki's recent degeneration as a composer. I somewhat like the song Angel, even though it's basically the same as Tolkki's Ari Koivunen track Angels Are Calling. And the similar Angel ballads didn't stop there, no way. (Symfonia - Alayna.)

The Hills Have Eyes I didn't first like musically. Nowadays I like, but it sure took a long time. And it spoiled me the movie!

When Mountains Fall. I, too, felt it's too much like Forever, and I can't help it. If I got to choose, of course I'd like all their songs. Unfortunately that's not how it goes. Also, I expected something else than a ballad from its name, and thought they're finally going to break the album-must-end-with-a-ballad thinking. They didn't. Also, Emancipation Suite is so breathtakingly huge for me it doesn't need any tracks after it to spoil the feeling.

Uh, yeah, A Drop in the Ocean pretty much suffers the same fate in my "book". Also, too minimalistic. And Elements doesn't need a follow-up song anymore. Those were the times when there always had to be nine songs in one album, and Tolkki was at his peak / most artistic he's been. A Drop... would be more Hymn to Life than Elements caliber a song in my opinion. I don't care if the outro perfectly integrates into Alpha & Omega's intro - it's still too long and boring! At least it's different, and some people really like its calming atmosphere. Wish I did.

That's all I can think of right now. Oh, and if Hills Have Eyes was a slow track for me to get, so was It's a Mystery. I actually appreciate this poppy track pretty much now as it's, like, the only song one of my friends knows from them.

Wow! Which ones DO you like?

[rikkertje]

030366, The Abyss of Your Eyes, Paradise, No Turning Back.

I've put them in chronological order. From Infinite till now they haven't really made songs I dislike.

maybe luminous... Too cheesy.

I thought about it, listened to it again, and had to conclude that I do like it.

[CCCCCCCC]

What about Platypus?

Perry the Platypus

[Verdades Parias]

Years go by...030366...I never get "Papillon"....also, ...Higher we go is nothing special, "Babylon", Leave the tribe, "just carry on" is so cheesy, almost gay, a tipical Tolkkis new kind of songs, very AOR...i hate that songs (I did it my way, Pilgrim Road...etc)

[HinatAArcticA]

Anything from Polaris and Elysium. The difference in quality from Tolkki era is quite obvious. Even the artwork is shit now. From dolphin to pelican. That symbolizes the changes of this band.

As always, I just state my opinion...

I was never a fan of Higher We Go. I really feel that one really avarage and kindda boring (Except for the guitar solo). I have to say that I don't like TK's compositions that much. At least what is outside Elysium.

About Event Horizon, it's a like the fast virtuos track of the album, but not that good I think. I would have placed Castaway instead I think.

And as I said, I never really got into Tolkki's long tracks. Destiny I kinda like.

[Ilsekena]

030366 is pure shit

More respect please!
It's a fucking masterpiece!!!!!!!!!!

[Mormegil]

030366. Queensrÿche - Screaming in Digital clone. There are actually many things in Stratovarius' music that are straight from QR (and many other bands as well). Child of Fire: "Look around / Is this the end you've foreseen?" <-> Fright Night: "Look around / Is this the end you see?". And Falling into Fantasy is very similar to The Lady Wore Black. Not all the songs stand on their own, but are too close to already existing songs. (Fright Night of course more notably towards Helloween's Halloween).

Sadly I have to agree here. TT has always tendency to rip-o... uh, "pay homage" to other bands a little too obviously for my taste.
Oh, and I hadn't noticed the Lady Wore Black - Faling Into Fantasy similarity before, so thanks for ruining one more song for me.

030366, The Abyss of Your Eyes, Paradise, No Turning Back.

030366, The Abyss of Your Eyes, Paradise, No Turning Back.

030366, The Abyss of Your Eyes, Paradise, No Turning Back.

030366, THE ABYSS OF YOUR EYES, Paradise, No Turning Back.

[Jabi]

Ok, my bottom five would be like this:

5) Paradise. This one just got so old so fast

4) Götterdämmerwhatever. The Hitler song. Kind of boring.

3) Know the Difference. Cliched, dull, predictable chord progressions, unoriginal.

2) Fantasia. The least successful of Stratovarius' long epics. Some too predictable chord progressions here too.

1) Somehow Precious. I don't like this song at all.

Oh, and I absolutely love The Abyss of Your Eyes.

[HoldenCaulfield]

When I was reading Intiaani's post and the opinions about some songs, I felt like jumping out the window.

Anyway, you could tell Intiaani was trying to concentrate and all.

[bockrocker]

Anything from Polaris and Elysium. The difference in quality from Tolkki era is quite obvious. Even the artwork is shit now. From dolphin to pelican. That symbolizes the changes of this band.

As always, I just state my opinion...

Errr wut? Infinite looks like it was made from bad internet clip art lol.

P.S. Infinite has a pelican on it too

I would say 4000 Rainy Nights is probably my least favorite Strato song.

[robocop656]

I'd say.. When the sea cow meets the oreo. (Chinese demo version)
And... Purple rain (live unreleased ggonza remix)
But the bonus dubstep remix of "The horse pussy" really knocked my socks off.

[Rebel]

4000 Rainy Nights

[Sumerian]

Anything from Polaris and Elysium. The difference in quality from Tolkki era is quite obvious. Even the artwork is shit now. From dolphin to pelican. That symbolizes the changes of this band.

As always, I just state my opinion...

Errr wut? Infinite looks like it was made from bad internet clip art lol.

P.S. Infinite has a pelican on it too

That is total bullshit.



I have read an interview from Timo Tolkki where he explains the album cover. Normally they take quite long time but this one came to him almost immediately. Very strange...

Concept is quite brilliant, with two gold dolphins. Why not silver, or platinum? Think about what that could represent. Of course, it is because this was "golden era" of Stratovarius.

Do you see two ships? One on the left and one on the right. They are very different contrast. Old and the new. Young and the old. Good vs. evil and perhaps Timo's never ending "infinite" struggle for musical justice.

And you can see the majestic "Saturn in the Morning" to add some class and depth to this masterpiece. This album expresses many different things in a very beautiful and peaceful way. I can study for days and am still amazed at artistic genius. It truly defines and represents Stratovarius "golden" era and I almost cry when I see it.



And here, we have fucking bird that looks like heroin addict.

[HoldenCaulfield]

Sumerian, seems you are going through a phase again.

Among other things, you'll find that you’re not the first person who was ever confused and frightened and even sickened by pelican behaviour. You're not alone.

Many, many men have been just as troubled morally and spiritually as you are right now. Happily, some of them kept one feather of their pelicans. You’ll learn from them if you want to. Just as someday, if you have something to offer, someone will learn something from you.

Meanwhile, you could keep writting about drugs and pelicans if you don't have anything else to offer.

Anyway, do you happen to know why the golden dolphin jumping to the left is all golden and the one jumping to the right is blue and gold.

And why is the blue-gold dolphin trying to eat the F from Infinite word. Or is he trying to eat the N? Or it is all about the small toy-dolphin?

And what about the buildings? Both sides are the same style more or less. The ship on the right side seems the one used by Hernán Cortés in 1518 and the newest ship seems the one in Miami Vice or Mission Impossible. Why are the buildings at the Hernán Cortés side that modern? I think there's somekind of anachronism in the artwork.

[Jabi]

I have to say that I don't like TK's compositions that much. At least what is outside Elysium.

I think the problem is that TK is more like a hard rock composer. He's good at writing KOTIPELTO songs. I like his solo stuff. But when he tries to write Stratovarius style power metal he might be outside his comfort zone or something. I can totally understand why TT rarely accepted his songs on Stratovarius records.

"Uncertainty" was kind of cool though.

[mayhem-for-all]

I have to say that I don't like TK's compositions that much. At least what is outside Elysium.

I think the problem is that TK is more like a hard rock composer. He's good at writing KOTIPELTO songs. I like his solo stuff. But when he tries to write Stratovarius style power metal he might be outside his comfort zone or something. I can totally understand why TT rarely accepted his songs on Stratovarius records.

"Uncertainty" was kind of cool though.

Pretty much yes. But he also has a power metal and even a prog side to him. For example Knowledge and Wisdom could very well be a Strato song and Movement of the Nile is one of the most beatiful (and catchy) songs by TK. the way he uses his voice on that one is simply perfect.

[AAAAAAAAAA]

I have to say that I don't like TK's compositions that much. At least what is outside Elysium.

I think the problem is that TK is more like a hard rock composer. He's good at writing KOTIPELTO songs. I like his solo stuff. But when he tries to write Stratovarius style power metal he might be outside his comfort zone or something. I can totally understand why TT rarely accepted his songs on Stratovarius records.

"Uncertainty" was kind of cool though.

Pretty much yes. But he also has a power metal and even a prog side to him. For example Knowledge and Wisdom could very well be a Strato song and Movement of the Nile is one of the most beatiful (and catchy) songs by TK. the way he uses his voice on that one is simply perfect.

His solo album "Serenity" is a freakin' masterpiece. He's a very talented songwriter.

[Ilsekena]

I have to say that I don't like TK's compositions that much. At least what is outside Elysium.

I think the problem is that TK is more like a hard rock composer. He's good at writing KOTIPELTO songs. I like his solo stuff. But when he tries to write Stratovarius style power metal he might be outside his comfort zone or something. I can totally understand why TT rarely accepted his songs on Stratovarius records.

"Uncertainty" was kind of cool though.

Pretty much yes. But he also has a power metal and even a prog side to him. For example Knowledge and Wisdom could very well be a Strato song and Movement of the Nile is one of the most beatiful (and catchy) songs by TK. the way he uses his voice on that one is simply perfect.

His solo album "Serenity" is a freakin' masterpiece. He's a very talented songwriter.

Very very true words! :luv1:

[HinatAArcticA]

Anything from Polaris and Elysium. The difference in quality from Tolkki era is quite obvious. Even the artwork is shit now. From dolphin to pelican. That symbolizes the changes of this band.

As always, I just state my opinion...

Errr wut? Infinite looks like it was made from bad internet clip art lol.

P.S. Infinite has a pelican on it too

That is total bullshit.

You are bullshit

Going back to the topic
My problem with some of TK's compositions, is that some sound too generic (to me). They usually have an intro, which has the same chord progression of the chorus and the solo, and usually it's a simple chord progression.

But I have to point out that is not that I don't like his songs at all. I just like them a bit less when it comes to Strato songs. His solo albums work better for me

Also... I was listening to Full Moon today, and I think I like it somewhat...

[Sumerian]

Translation: I have no idea what graphic composition is about and I'm blinded by fanatism and I have no idea what the hell I'm talking about.

Quite funny that I am accused here of fanaticism (of all places), when I simply write my opinion.

You say "What could they symbolize" which means you have no fucking idea about what you are talking about, just creating your own "perfect" image of whatever a cover means to you.

No, I understand the true meaning of this very peaceful art, because I have deep spiritual connection with this album. Infinite marked the beginning of Timo Tolkki's spiritual awakening, and you can feel that even through album cover. You have a lot to learn about art, kid

Infinite cover is cool, and so is Elysium's. Btw, you say it could represent "Good vs Evil", but TT has allways said that he wants NOTHING to do with anything "evil". He would not represent an "evil ship" on the cover, you are just making it all up

And how can you know what Timo thinks of the evil ship? I look at that ship and it looks very, very evil to me. Sinister, almost. I can feel the darkness and the hatred, coming from that ship. It is very important spiritual message and sometimes we must show example of great evils and face it, to overcome them.

Did you ever read what the Elysium cover meant? Jörg explained it on an interview. Or you are going to bash Jörg too? Are you that fucked up?

Yes, let's face it, the Stratovarius money-factory must cook up some story to sell their album but in the end it is just a fucking bird. There is nothing deep or moving about the album artwork. It does not brings tears to my eye or make me shake with passion like Infinite.

Why I would ever bash Jörg? I think he made right choice of leaving, because Stratovarius ship is sinking fast. I'll let you decide what kind of ship it is...

"From Dolphins To Pelicans"

[HinatAArcticA]

I simply write my opinion.

That is blinded by fanatism And the fact you don't see it is the best proof.

No, I understand the true meaning of this very peaceful art, because I have deep spiritual connection with this album. Infinite marked the beginning of Timo Tolkki's spiritual awakening, and you can feel that even through album cover. You have a lot to learn about art, kid

Yeah, you wish you were TT don'y you? And you know of art what, I know of advanced chemistry, that's very clear to me.

And how can you know what Timo thinks of the evil ship?

And how can you know?

Yes, let's face it, the Stratovarius money-factory must cook up some story to sell their album but in the end it is just a fucking bird. There is nothing deep or moving about the album artwork. It does not brings tears to my eye or make me shake with passion like Infinite.

Why I would ever bash Jörg? I think he made right choice of leaving, because Stratovarius ship is sinking fast. I'll let you decide what kind of ship it is...

"From Dolphins To Pelicans"

What's up with your aggresivnes?

I have to wonder... if you hate this band, why are you still here? Is writting in the forum of a band you hate the only way to spend your time?

And that little number you pulled out a few months back that you were Timo Tolkki and shit? That was very "deep" and "mature" and "artistic" I guess

So here's the question again: Why are you still here?

To bash the band? You like destruction and negative thoughts towards a music band? Jens said it: "We make music that makes people happy, and it seems to offend only one person" (he meant TT back then), but it seems it offends you too, still you are here at the forum bashing the band for no reason. Compared to you, TT's posts "against" new Strato are very polite and reserved. And to say Elysium has nothing deep on it only makes me realize how deep in your blind fanatism you are.

Why do I even bother with you?

[HoldenCaulfield]

Sumerian, could you please let me know when and where is going to be the flower shop opened?

And what about the plans about start teaching Meänkieli at the "convent" near Rakuunantie street? There, where you can't even hear any cars.

Please, it is very important for me to know. I will need an interview to talk about the NRBG issue (Never Received Black Guitar), and the routine on joining a heavy metal monastery.
If possible, I would like to hear an explanation about some pages of the book "Loneliness of a thousand years old Elephant Shrew", in the Dukan diet part.


Many thanks for your collaboration.

[Verdades Parias]

Sumerian, could you please let me know when and where is going to be the flower shop opened?

+1

Absolutely true, the men is blinded by a penis or something, so much that he bought "SAANA - ONION OF FIGHT" and actually liked it!!!... I'm pretty much sure that he thinks that the solos of the highly anticipated (I don't know when comes out) TRINITY ALBUM has revolutionary solos of the one and only, Timo Tolkki's 31 years old son.

I mean...this men is playing with us all the time, we all know the truth about how Timo Tolkki is sinking, He doesn't have any fucking idea of how sell his recycled music...his last 6 albums("stratovarius", "new era","SARNA" "Age of crap" "Trinity" "so so paradisum"), are inmense metal crap, and the world knows it, thats the only reason why is crying in his twitter "trust in us", thats the reason why he's opening a flower shop by the end of 2011...c'mon!...stop fooling yourself, be a men!
It piss me of so much those people defending a men who lied in our fucking face, shameless...Even he still trying to convince us that 2004 was an agreement of the band...CREATED BY AN ALIEN CALLED CARLITOS, c'mon open your eyes people.

I despise Sumerian, sorry for so many flames, so sorry, it's just....the Zenith of Idiocy

Oh!...and this is only an opinion (fart)

[Sumerian]

I have to wonder... if you hate this band, why are you still here? Is writting in the forum of a band you hate the only way to spend your time?

I loved this band before they started making evil music. Yes.

And that little number you pulled out a few months back that you were Timo Tolkki and shit? That was very "deep" and "mature" and "artistic" I guess

I would not expect a child to understand. It was a very powerful statement I made, because most idiots here are accusing me of being TT. And so, I agreed "I am TT" to show how absurd can this comparison be. Fucking hell.

"We make music that makes people happy, and it seems to offend only one person" (he meant TT back then), but it seems it offends you too, still you are here at the forum bashing the band for no reason.

I am not bashing the band. I am simply expressing my opinion about the last two Stratovarius albums, that are very offensive and evil. And quite simply, they do not make sense to call it Stratovarius. If you slice an apple in half, can you still call it an apple?

Fuck, I read straight from Jens "To me money is just another tool in the toolbox, needed to make music". I actually cried when I first read that because I could not believe those wicked words. How little he understands about true art... Good music is not made with money. It is made with love, and there is no love in Stratovarius. Just pelicans. But of course, a lot of money is in the band, and you tell me how is the sound. Again, "From Dolphins to Pelicans".

Compared to you, TT's posts "against" new Strato are very polite and reserved.

There we can agree. He has shown nothing but class through this whole experience. We can tell he is at peace, because he is making healthy music that is from the heart, in Symfonia.

And to say Elysium has nothing deep on it only makes me realize how deep in your blind fanatism you are.

I'm sorry, let me correct. Elysium is very deep in my trash can now.

[Sumerian]

Absolutely true, the men is blinded by a penis or something

And you are homophobic. I think something says about tolerance in Stratovarius message. But i guess you only listen the new stuff, and that is based more on pelicans and space ships.

I mean...this men is playing with us all the time, we all know the truth about how Timo Tolkki is sinking, He doesn't have any fucking idea of how sell his recycled music...his last 6 albums("stratovarius", "new era","SARNA" "Age of crap" "Trinity" "so so paradisum"), are inmense metal crap, and the world knows it

Timo does not need to make money, because he has artistic vision. I bet he really cares whether you think his albums are "immense metal crap"

It piss me of so much those people defending a men who lied in our fucking face, shameless...Even he still trying to convince us that 2004 was an agreement of the band...

If there is one thing we can all be sure, is that Timo Tolkki has never lied. It is very clear now, all these years later, that he was right about everything. But of course, you still attack him in extremely violent way.