Download or buy ?

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necrolog
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Download or buy ?

Post by necrolog » Wed Oct 05, 2005 6:01 pm

This has probably been asked before, but what the hey! :)

Do you guys download songs or buy albums?

Myself, I download lots of songs, but buy probably 95% of what I download. Kinda like Try-Before-You-Buy.

Plus it's nice to have a huge CD collections, and all the artworks that come with it, and it shows support to the band. They wont tour in cities where the albums don't sell.

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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by necrolog » Wed Oct 05, 2005 6:05 pm

Muahaha, I posted in the wrong section!! Awesome

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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by MaFiaBoY » Wed Oct 05, 2005 6:30 pm

I never download, cause I'm on 56k and I think it's disrespectful towards the band. I sometimes buy CDs of bands I know only by name and have heard nothing of their stuff.
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StragOvariuS
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by StragOvariuS » Wed Oct 05, 2005 7:35 pm

To me works in this way:

Downloaded-i liked-earn some money-i buy
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DL or Buy

Post by Dragon77 » Wed Oct 05, 2005 8:09 pm

I'll agree with StragOvarius - as a matter of fact, I just bought the Infinite Visions DVD :D There are very few artists that I will just buy a CD of unheard (and that's no knock on any band - but even the best can have an "off" release).

Fans will always support the bands they love.

I guess a related question would be where do you buy from - is it used? Is it from a retailer (usually online) where the band won't get a cut? Remember, there are no royalties (or sales rankings) from used CDs/DVDs - so wouldn't that beg the question, isn't buying used items the same as downloading and not buying? (yeah, it's different in the intent, but the financial outcome for the band is the same).

Just a few thoughts 8)

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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by browneyedgirl » Wed Oct 05, 2005 9:16 pm

Always buy! Better safe than sorry!
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by MaFiaBoY » Wed Oct 05, 2005 10:29 pm

browneyedgirl wrote:Always buy! Better safe than sorry!
The Voice of Wisdom has spoken :D
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by fifthtea_sausage » Wed Oct 05, 2005 11:27 pm

1. Download one song
2. If liked, download 3 more
3. If liked, download whole album
4. If liked, buy another of their albums
5. If liked, buy the rest of the albums, including the one you downloaded

My philosophy.
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by Stealth » Thu Oct 06, 2005 12:06 am

Download.
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by StratoHeart » Thu Oct 06, 2005 12:54 am

I download. If I like, then I buy it.

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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by IceBreaker » Thu Oct 06, 2005 2:29 am

MaFiaBoY wrote:I never download, cause I'm on 56k and I think it's disrespectful towards the band. I sometimes buy CDs of bands I know only by name and have heard nothing of their stuff.
Hey, I´m doing mostly the same as you. (My another computer has still also only a 56k :? ) and either I don´t like downloading so much, because you still have a chance to buy the CDs and support the bands/artists. If I download something, they´re actually the official stuff from the homepages. :roll:

^I also am doing that same buy-but never heard way a bit, but sometimes that costs too much if thinking the material isn´t then so good. That´s why I try to check the official clips or songs first.
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by Equinox » Thu Oct 06, 2005 3:02 am

I have buy stuff from the net, legaly, so I can say that yes, I've download stuff.

And fisicaly too...
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MaFiaBoY
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by MaFiaBoY » Thu Oct 06, 2005 8:29 am

IceBreaker wrote:I also am doing that same buy-but never heard way a bit, but sometimes that costs too much if thinking the material isn´t then so good. That´s why I try to check the official clips or songs first.
I'd never pay 20 euros for unheard material but in a secondhand records shop near from where I live Cds are usually 7-9 euros so if I don't know what to buy I see a HammerFall CD and I think "Hey, lots of ppl told me HF kicks ass, I'm gonna try them out.", well that's the only case I thought after listening the CD "Fuck, I wasted my money on this crap ?".
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cliff
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by cliff » Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:52 am

fifthtea_sausage wrote:1. Download one song
2. If liked, download 3 more
3. If liked, download whole album
4. If liked, buy another of their albums
5. If liked, buy the rest of the albums, including the one you downloaded

My philosophy.
I like that one.
Usually I use iTunes to listen to samples, or I download albums with eMule and if I like the music really much (and can find the album for not too much), then I buy.
In the past I used to buy albums of artists that I liked without listening to the album before, and I was really disapointed, like last Nightwish, last Hammerfall, last Sonata Arctica.
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by Beast_Pete » Thu Oct 06, 2005 11:26 am

Unfortunately I don't have the money to buy every single or album, so I download most of them. Stratovarius is an exception, as I want to get all the albums (ok, I have them :P ), singles and rarities.

I have some Queen and some Bach as well. And I'd like to finally get a hand on Space Odyssey's Embrace the Galaxy. Hell, why can't the stores sell it? :?
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by nepi » Thu Oct 06, 2005 11:53 am

In any rare cases I download first any songs and when they kick my ass and bring my head to bang so I buy the album of course, with the words of necrolog: try-before-you-buy. And when they really still kick my ass, so I'm looking for rare stuff.
Often I buy the albums before I downloaded a song, but then I heard a song from a friend or saw the band as support.

@dragon77:"Fans will always support the bands they love." - truly words!

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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by Stratofanius » Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:50 pm

Because I have this damn modem, I only download some songs.
But I don't care, because buying album is much more enjoyable than just downloading album.
The album case, booklet... everything is better and there is much more feeling when you buy the album.

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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by iron_thunder » Thu Oct 06, 2005 5:16 pm

MaFiaBoY wrote:
browneyedgirl wrote:Always buy! Better safe than sorry!
The Voice of Wisdom has spoken :D

That whole exchange just warmed my heart, somehow. :luv4:

and yes, i buy. sometimes i download to see if i like it, but my computer's such a piece of shit that it's really not worth it. buying is the way to go :) and it keeps the bands in business.
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Electric Eye
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by Electric Eye » Thu Oct 06, 2005 6:33 pm

Let's say it outright: the question is not download or buy, the question is steal or buy.
So where does the power come from to see the race to its end?
From within.

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StragOvariuS
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by StragOvariuS » Thu Oct 06, 2005 6:57 pm

Electric Eye wrote:Let's say it outright: the question is not download or buy, the question is steal or buy.
nope...then if i get a sample im "stealing" too. :wink:
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by Stratovaried » Thu Oct 06, 2005 7:48 pm

I havent downloaded songs or albums for a year now, and i wont... But i download some expensive games and programs, becouse im running short on money if i buy a 100€ programs and 60 € games :roll: .
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Dragon77
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Stealing

Post by Dragon77 » Thu Oct 06, 2005 8:47 pm

I am still in opposition to the declaration that downloading is stealing.

Remember, the VAST majority of those who download and do not later buy, would NEVER have bought in the first place. 1 download does not equal 1 lost sale - period. No ifs, ands, or buts on that issue. Itmay equal 1 lost potential sale - and the two are not the same.

How many returns do you think stores/record companies would see if people were allowed to return the albums they bought and then found out they didn't like? You'll never see that happen - even if DRM was 100% effective. Think about it - if a CD was 100% copy protected (meaning there was absolutely no chance whatsoever that a copy could be made in any manner), you still would not be allowed to return it after you opened it (even though copying is the reason that you can't return opened CDs/DVDs). It would ruin their sales numbers - first week sales would have to be later re-calculated. Maybe an artist sold 50,000 CDs the first week, but the tracks were so bad that 40,000 people returned it - what would that do for the record company's stats? As it stands now, those 40,000 are basically screwed out of the money they paid - it's like buying a car and having it break down a week later. With downloading, record companies (and bands) have to develop a new marketing/sales methodology.

I would liken the downloading issue to another current issue - weather information. For years, the National Weather Service has made their information freely available to the public and private sectors alike - however, it wasn't necessarily easy for the public sector to get the information. Now, with computers and the internet, anyone at home can get all the information they want - and this is hurting the private companies who make their business by selling that same information. Should the public pay the price because some private company has an out-dated business model? I'd say that would be like penalizing the electric company because they put some candlemakers out of business - or punishing the automakers because they put the carriagemakers out of business (oh, wait, that ALSO happened).

Hmm, now what do they say about those who fail to learn from the past? .....

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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by Aresius » Thu Oct 06, 2005 9:33 pm

Well... I download a LOT, discographys, videos, rare songs and so on.
Here in argentina cds are 30 pesos and we dont have all this cds like in europe, only a few (forget about rare things ).

I also buy cds, y have like 35 cds and that is like 1000 pesos so i think im fan enough
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by StratoNess » Thu Oct 06, 2005 9:56 pm

StragOvariuS wrote:To me works in this way:

Downloaded-i liked-earn some money-i buy
I agree.

There is too much crap out there. We, as consumers, deserve to test an album before we purchase it, especially if the band's website has a limited amount or length of sample songs.


I have over 300 cds, so I can safely say I do not abuse downloading.

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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by King of metal » Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:18 pm

I see a HammerFall CD and I think "Hey, lots of ppl told me HF kicks ass, I'm gonna try them out.", well that's the only case I thought after listening the CD "Fuck, I wasted my money on this crap ?".
Don't you like HF??? :shock: I hope you will like it after the concert :) , because HF kicks ass indeed!!!

I always buy my CDs :)

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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by MaFiaBoY » Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:22 pm

King of metal wrote:
I see a HammerFall CD and I think "Hey, lots of ppl told me HF kicks ass, I'm gonna try them out.", well that's the only case I thought after listening the CD "Fuck, I wasted my money on this crap ?".
Don't you like HF??? :shock: I hope you will like it after the concert :) , because HF kicks ass indeed!!!
HF are the worst band ever, nothing could change my opinion about this. And I'm not going to the gig :cry:
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by Fireblade » Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:25 pm

In a CD sale, 80% goes toward the label and shop that sells it.
12% to the artist.

In legal download, 80% and 6%, not 12.

In illegal download, 0% to all parties, 100% some unscrupulous soul vulture.

I'm temporarily employed, have towering student debts still, and yet I BUY, to support the musicians I like... most of which have day jobs that they have to take holiday from to tour. (Strato are an exception :wink: )

If it's popular enough to be on mainsteam radio, eg. some heavier pop (Robbie Williams), then I tape it. I don't spend my cash on something that millions of ppl rather than thousands, buy. That's naughty, but the mainstream have plenty of income and no towering student debts.
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by Electric Eye » Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:31 pm

StragOvariuS wrote:
Electric Eye wrote:Let's say it outright: the question is not download or buy, the question is steal or buy.
nope...then if i get a sample im "stealing" too. :wink:
of course not, samples are made to download them and check it. It is like sample goods in shops. They are free for customers, to check and choose the one that suits the best. Nonsensical argument...
Dragon77 wrote:Remember, the VAST majority of those who download and do not later buy, would NEVER have bought in the first place.
another nonsense. That means this VAST majority are thieves - they consumed records (i.e. heard the song) and didn't pay for it. This is simple and clear.
Dragon77 wrote:How many returns do you think stores/record companies would see if people were allowed to return the albums they bought and then found out they didn't like?
But are they allowed to return CD? Do you think shopkeepers will give your money back if you don't like the music you bought? It is like entering into cake shop, tasting all cakes they have, and buying only one or none. Pointless, isn't it?
In case music or art at all, everything you buy it's your own risk and a matter of trust towards artist. Media allow us to do a proper choice by playing singles (songs promoting albums), or broadcasting videos. I know, that many kind of music does not exist in media, but it is another issue.
So where does the power come from to see the race to its end?
From within.

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MaFiaBoY
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by MaFiaBoY » Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:45 pm

Electric Eye wrote:
StragOvariuS wrote:
Electric Eye wrote:Let's say it outright: the question is not download or buy, the question is steal or buy.
nope...then if i get a sample im "stealing" too. :wink:
of course not, samples are made to download them and check it. It is like sample goods in shops. They are free for customers, to check and choose the ine that suits the best. Nonsensical argument...
Dragon77 wrote:Remember, the VAST majority of those who download and do not later buy, would NEVER have bought in the first place.
another nonsense. That means this VAST majority are thieves - they consumed records (i.e. heard the song) and didn't pay for it. This is simple and clear.
Dragon77 wrote:How many returns do you think stores/record companies would see if people were allowed to return the albums they bought and then found out they didn't like?
But are they allowed to return CD? Do you think shopkeepers will give your money back if you don't like the music you bought? It is like entering into cake shop, tasting all cakes they have, and buying only one or none. Pointless, isn't it?
In case music or art at all, everything you buy it's your own risk and a matter of trust towards artist. Media allow us to do a proper choice by playing singles (songs promoting albums), or broadcasting videos. I know, that many kind of music does not exist in media, but it is another issue.[/quote]

Agreed 100%
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cliff
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Re: Download or buy ?

Post by cliff » Fri Oct 07, 2005 12:27 am

Fireblade wrote:In a CD sale, 80% goes toward the label and shop that sells it.
12% to the artist.

In legal download, 80% and 6%, not 12.
Are you sure of those ? Because I heard that with legal download, it's the label who get less money than with CD sellings and the artists get the same money, but I'm not sure about that.
If you're right, i think it's a real shame !!! What the hell, it's the artists who play and are responsible for the music! The label just give an advance for the recording of the album, make some "promo" with sending CDs to journalists (who put them on the internet a couple of days later). Shouldn't it be 80% for the artists and 12% for the label ? Well, life's unfair.

I don't spend my cash on something that millions of ppl rather than thousands, buy. That's naughty, but the mainstream have plenty of income and no towering student debts.
You have a good point.
but in my opinion, if you REALLY REALLY love one album, the huge income of the artists is not a reason not to buy it, even if I really understand your point.

Someone here mentionned about the small budget, and buying videogames and stuffs. Well, in my opinion, people have to choose their priorities, but STILL, if you prefer videogames than music, then spend your money on videogames and don't listen to music. I have a friend who is like that. Just because he is crazy of videogames (and spend all his money on them), he NEVER buys any CD, but he download everything and has every new album. he listens to all of them and enjoy them. Is it fair, for some people like me or others, who buy albums to help the artists and to allow them to release new albums ? i don't think so.
You can download, fine, but at least buy albums sometimes.

I think the main problem on this download / buy CD is the price of CDs and the huge money that labels suck from artists. Like Fireblade mentionned, the music industry is totally unfair. Actually, it's just like every industry. For ex, you pay 50€ for shoes, when some poor little chinese slaves were payed 1€ to make them, and Mister Nike get all the rest of the money and stuff. But well, welcome to the Capitalism World. :evil:
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