Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

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Ragehead91
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Ragehead91 » Mon May 25, 2009 12:36 am

Luna wrote:
Ragehead91 wrote:
hiro23 wrote:
Luna wrote:
Ragehead91 wrote:
Luna wrote:Great news! It's not bad to establish another band,since Kotipelto showed an undiscovered aspect of TK that I'd never known in Strato.I think TK is a geat creator with endless effort and everlasting passion in producing music. Maybe to some extent music is a way for him to express himself, which is made better by utilization of variety.
I expect Cain will offer a different style from Strato and Kotipelto that uncovers a new aspect of TK.
It worth waiting!
What kind of new aspect? Growling? I don't really see what Kotipelto can bring to the table other than that what we already know. I'm not saying that he is a bad singer, I just don't think that he will try something new that we didn't already heard on Strato and Kotipelto.
No, I'm not talking about his vocal performance merely but combined with his ability in composing,lyrics writing,and rythm mastering.Maybe you are not that interested in his hard-styled creation,but to me,his creativity in bass and drum beats is really fantastic which I will never experience without Kotipelto.
I'm with Luna on this one
Well, thing is that Jani wrote and composed all the stuff IIRC so I don't think Koti had that much influence.

It's hard to say,things sometimes are not what they seem to be,any way,I'm positive. :)
I'm not saying that this is a bad thing per se. I don't really know how Jani writes and composes his songs because AFAIK Tony Kakko wrote and composed most of the stuff in Sonata Arctica. I'm also looking forward to that album.

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by browneyedgirl » Mon May 25, 2009 4:49 am

Syren.S wrote:the article looks serious
(here's the magazine, with its headlines: http://blogs.yahoo.co.jp/hokeypokeyyoud ... 44466.html)

but I still feel some doubt... I mean, Cain's Offering, isn't that rejected by the God? because it's not faithful or something...
and the album is called "gather the faithful"?
it still makes a cool name, but i have to say, this is weird. :roll:
In the Bible, Cain made an offering to God, and supposedly because of Cain's attitude, God rejected the offering. God did not like the offering!
The name can be analyzed to mean something, but I'm not going to touch it. I think people can figure it out.
Its a unique name, though. Easy to remember!

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by mayhem-for-all » Mon May 25, 2009 6:11 am

I'm not saying that this is a bad thing per se. I don't really know how Jani writes and composes his songs because AFAIK Tony Kakko wrote and composed most of the stuff in Sonata Arctica. I'm also looking forward to that album.
Tony always said that Jani had so huge influence on the final versions of the songs by the arrangements that he was almost co-writer.
But after Ecliptica the influence started to fade until he wrote my Selene (a great mix of ballad and a fast song)
And he has composed for Sturm und Drang, Altaria...
His works are good. Just good.

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Luna » Mon May 25, 2009 7:37 am

Ragehead91 wrote:
Luna wrote:
Ragehead91 wrote:
hiro23 wrote:
Luna wrote:
Ragehead91 wrote:
Luna wrote:Great news! It's not bad to establish another band,since Kotipelto showed an undiscovered aspect of TK that I'd never known in Strato.I think TK is a geat creator with endless effort and everlasting passion in producing music. Maybe to some extent music is a way for him to express himself, which is made better by utilization of variety.
I expect Cain will offer a different style from Strato and Kotipelto that uncovers a new aspect of TK.
It worth waiting!
What kind of new aspect? Growling? I don't really see what Kotipelto can bring to the table other than that what we already know. I'm not saying that he is a bad singer, I just don't think that he will try something new that we didn't already heard on Strato and Kotipelto.
No, I'm not talking about his vocal performance merely but combined with his ability in composing,lyrics writing,and rythm mastering.Maybe you are not that interested in his hard-styled creation,but to me,his creativity in bass and drum beats is really fantastic which I will never experience without Kotipelto.
I'm with Luna on this one
Well, thing is that Jani wrote and composed all the stuff IIRC so I don't think Koti had that much influence.

It's hard to say,things sometimes are not what they seem to be,any way,I'm positive. :)
I'm not saying that this is a bad thing per se. I don't really know how Jani writes and composes his songs because AFAIK Tony Kakko wrote and composed most of the stuff in Sonata Arctica. I'm also looking forward to that album.
I don't mean that it's bad, but in my opinion TK seldom gives up any chance to express his own idea,as he did in Strato during the past 15 years,and every album is a fruit of co-operation,so I think this time, he might not be that unimportant.
It's a far,far better thing that I do than I have ever done;It's a far,far better rest that I go than I have ever known.

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by hiro23 » Mon May 25, 2009 9:17 am

What I don't get, and remember this is just an opinion is why some people will talk about a Timo Kotipelto song like it's something bad, seriously in a lot of discussions I've seen it'll be like "oh we'll Kotipelto wrote it" and someone will say something to the effect of "ah I see so that's why it's not so good"

I seriously don't get this hatred of Kotipelto's writing, I think the guy is a great songwriter and I listen to his solo albums quite frequently.

People can say what they want about the song "higher we go" but you can't tell me that the song isn't catchy as hell.
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Luna
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Luna » Mon May 25, 2009 10:10 am

hiro23 wrote:What I don't get, and remember this is just an opinion is why some people will talk about a Timo Kotipelto song like it's something bad, seriously in a lot of discussions I've seen it'll be like "oh we'll Kotipelto wrote it" and someone will say something to the effect of "ah I see so that's why it's not so good"

I seriously don't get this hatred of Kotipelto's writing, I think the guy is a great songwriter and I listen to his solo albums quite frequently.

People can say what they want about the song "higher we go" but you can't tell me that the song isn't catchy as hell.
Maybe people got that hatred coz Kotipelto's products are not similar to Strato's at all.I think every musician have his personal way of expression,better than one style,and TK's merit is his novelty--there is only one TK in the world and nobody could be a second.
I've been enjoying some excellent songs of Kotipelto like Beginning,Coldness of my mind,Take me away,once upon a time etc.
It's a far,far better thing that I do than I have ever done;It's a far,far better rest that I go than I have ever known.

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Ragehead91 » Mon May 25, 2009 3:21 pm

hiro23 wrote:What I don't get, and remember this is just an opinion is why some people will talk about a Timo Kotipelto song like it's something bad, seriously in a lot of discussions I've seen it'll be like "oh we'll Kotipelto wrote it" and someone will say something to the effect of "ah I see so that's why it's not so good"

I seriously don't get this hatred of Kotipelto's writing, I think the guy is a great songwriter and I listen to his solo albums quite frequently.

People can say what they want about the song "higher we go" but you can't tell me that the song isn't catchy as hell.
I have to disagree here. With all due respect I always though Kotipeltos Songwritting was rather dull.

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Aldaron » Mon May 25, 2009 5:27 pm

There always seems to be two camps when it comes to Timo's songwriting; those who love it and those who find it uninspired. People seem to be firmly entrenched one way or another with few in the middle ground.

I have always liked his songs, though I found them lighter then some of the other music I prefer. But then, I like to have many different types of music in my collection for different moods. I usually listen to Timo's albums while driving or working because it's easy to listen to, up beat and not distracting.

On the other hand, I heard all of Polaris a few times before seeing the credits and I was completely fooled by the compositions. I was positive "Deep Unkown" and "Somehow Precious" were written by Jens and I was sure "King of Nothing" was written by Timo because it reminded me of "Last Defender." So, anyway, I think this album has shown an expansion of everyone's composing talents and I really don't hear a "sameness" to other things they've written.
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Ragehead91 » Mon May 25, 2009 8:53 pm

Aldaron wrote:There always seems to be two camps when it comes to Timo's songwriting; those who love it and those who find it uninspired. People seem to be firmly entrenched one way or another with few in the middle ground.

I have always liked his songs, though I found them lighter then some of the other music I prefer. But then, I like to have many different types of music in my collection for different moods. I usually listen to Timo's albums while driving or working because it's easy to listen to, up beat and not distracting.

On the other hand, I heard all of Polaris a few times before seeing the credits and I was completely fooled by the compositions. I was positive "Deep Unkown" and "Somehow Precious" were written by Jens and I was sure "King of Nothing" was written by Timo because it reminded me of "Last Defender." So, anyway, I think this album has shown an expansion of everyone's composing talents and I really don't hear a "sameness" to other things they've written.
I have to disagree. With Higher We Go and Somehow Precious at least I did now very fast that those were Koti songs. Deep Unknown was very hard since Kupianen was involved in that song.

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by hiro23 » Tue May 26, 2009 2:03 am

And that's fine, I'm not saying what people should or should not do, I'm just saying I like Kotipelto's songwriting and I don't understand why some people don't like it.

But it's perfectly fine if you don't like it, I have no problem with that.
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Luna » Tue May 26, 2009 3:33 am

hiro23 wrote:And that's fine, I'm not saying what people should or should not do, I'm just saying I like Kotipelto's songwriting and I don't understand why some people don't like it.

But it's perfectly fine if you don't like it, I have no problem with that.
Yeah,I'd rather treat them more personally too.Maybe TK's style isn't acceptable by everyone,but it should not be simply viewed as "good" or "bad".
It's a far,far better thing that I do than I have ever done;It's a far,far better rest that I go than I have ever known.

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by palarmux » Tue May 26, 2009 7:28 am

I like TK:s songs, but Johansson and Porra do a bit better songs for stratovarius. :) Kotipelto's songs are better for his own "Kotipelto" -band. But it's just good, if TK does few songs for every strato album :) It makes a little different

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Eruaistaniel » Tue May 26, 2009 10:37 am

While in Stratovarius TK had his solo albums, Jens appeared in sooo many albums, Lauri his collaborations and solo career... And Jorg, well, he played in countless bands! But we always got Stratovarius albums, gigs, and whatever.

Kotipelto finished the recordings just few weeks before Stratovarius tour, and, in my opinion, in that moment, Cain's Offering was his "priority"... as it is for the other members when they are involved in any other project, or band, or solo album.

Making and playing music is a way of inner expression, first of all (fun is besides that, of course)... anyone can't always do the same things, or play the same stuff (in this case).

And it's also very nice listening to some different things from the Strato members... i.e. Jens and Lauri are also playing completely different music...
but it's not a sufficient condition for them to leave Stratovarius...

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by hiro23 » Tue May 26, 2009 10:43 pm

I think each members has many strengths, I really don't think of anyone as a "inferior member". Each one just has a different way of doing things.
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Valkyrie Lycan » Tue Jun 09, 2009 10:37 pm

Eruaistaniel wrote:While in Stratovarius TK had his solo albums, Jens appeared in sooo many albums, Lauri his collaborations and solo career... And Jorg, well, he played in countless bands! But we always got Stratovarius albums, gigs, and whatever.

Kotipelto finished the recordings just few weeks before Stratovarius tour, and, in my opinion, in that moment, Cain's Offering was his "priority"... as it is for the other members when they are involved in any other project, or band, or solo album.

Making and playing music is a way of inner expression, first of all (fun is besides that, of course)... anyone can't always do the same things, or play the same stuff (in this case).

And it's also very nice listening to some different things from the Strato members... i.e. Jens and Lauri are also playing completely different music...
but it's not a sufficient condition for them to leave Stratovarius...
I agree totally. I don't think there is anything to worry about. It shows the artists diversity. My favourite artists are those who are not afraid to break out of the box and experiment, I am sure we will see a complete new side of TK - creative people need the challenge and TK is to dedicated to music as well as being a perfectionist, that I doubt he would take on more than he can handle. For me Stratovarius only became interesting when TK joined the band as vocalist. before then it did not do much for me at all, so needless to say I am as much of a TK fan as a Stratovarius fan - so goes without saying, I am looking forward to this new album and my 100% support is guaranteed to whatever he turns his hands to or wherever he is involved.

It shows his multi talented side, which I more than welcome - might be a taste question but for me it is interesting to hear the results, definatly love Kotipelto project equally as Stratovarius. :)

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by hiro23 » Wed Jun 10, 2009 6:01 am

I agree, I can't wait to hear what members from both Stratovarius and Sonata arctica will sound like when their efforts are combined.
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Valkyrie Lycan » Wed Jun 10, 2009 7:54 pm

yep an interesting concept and line up - especially since Sonata Arctica has been another one of my favourite bands for ages - so definatly an essential album to buy for me :)

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by hiro23 » Wed Jun 10, 2009 9:41 pm

I have a feeling it's going to be epic
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Luna » Sun Jun 14, 2009 7:38 pm

hiro23 wrote:I have a feeling it's going to be epic
Isn't there any possibility of folk metal? :laff: :laff: :laff: :laff: :laff:
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by hiro23 » Sun Jun 14, 2009 9:46 pm

Luna:of course, listen to Rhapsody of Fire :D
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Ragehead91 » Sun Jun 14, 2009 9:47 pm

Folk Metal and Rhapsody? What?

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by hiro23 » Sun Jun 14, 2009 9:49 pm

My bad attempt at a joke ragehead, I love rhapsody of fire by the way, but you do have to admit many of their songs have a lot of folksy elements to them.
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Luna » Mon Jun 15, 2009 8:40 am

hiro23 wrote:Luna:of course, listen to Rhapsody of Fire :D
It's a nice band.And what if CO goes like Korpiklaani,the pure folk metal?Just imagine,there must be some funny :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Admittedly,folk metal is characteristic and very interesting. :) (forgive my off-topic 8) 8) )
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by icecab21 » Mon Jun 15, 2009 10:08 am

rhapsody has a ton of folk in its music

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by mayhem-for-all » Mon Jun 15, 2009 12:57 pm

icecab21 wrote:rhapsody has a ton of folk in its music
Yet more symphonic than Folk.
Without the choirs and the massive sound it would be more folk.

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by hiro23 » Mon Jun 15, 2009 9:48 pm

it depends on the song, the faster one's are definitely more symphonic however the ballads are more folksy.
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by mayhem-for-all » Tue Jun 16, 2009 10:43 am

hiro23 wrote:it depends on the song, the faster one's are definitely more symphonic however the ballads are more folksy.
Yep thats how it is.
Take forest of Unicorns (the most terrible and ridiculous song by Rhapsody) thats defionately folkier.

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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by hiro23 » Tue Jun 16, 2009 9:19 pm

However Magic of the wizards dream I think is the best ballad they've ever done
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Re: Cain´s Offering ...Timo K´s new band???

Post by Ragehead91 » Tue Jun 16, 2009 9:31 pm

Especially the version they've done with Christpher Lee! Just Awesome!

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