CHAOS in Norway

[Martin Van Buren]

I don't think Missouri should be accepted as a slave state. That is what I think. Its me- the illustrious Martin Van Buren!

MVB

[J.S. Bach]

Daddy? Is that you?

[browneyedgirl]

Larry Fine idolized Martin Van Buren so much that he copied his hairstyle.

[mayhem-for-all]

There is at least one major population center- Helsinki, right? Also, you don't have to live in a population center to encounter predators of other types- wildlife, for instance. I am sure that there are bear, boar, and other forms of animals that you wouldn't necessarily want to run up on.

Well Wolves, Lynxes and Wolverines are close to extinction here and the most dangearous being left are actually Elks along with bears. There are lots of elks and they are a great danger to traffic. Bears however try to stay away from humans as long as possible. Bears kill statistically 1-2 people in every 50 years. Then we also have one type of rattlesnake but it is not very poisonous.

Well there is a lot of discussion going on about should we try to keep the whole country populated as a lot of people are moving to cities. Farming is not the best way to make a living in a country with such winters. Yet to think of the scale of ours cities... Tokyo for example has almost three times the population of Finland in it.

I am quite sure that there is probably some sort of hunting culture in Finland- otherwise, they would not have beaten the Russians down as badly as they did during WWII. The Finns obviously knew how to hunt, how to fish, how to shoot, and moreover, knew their terrain rather well. The Russians haven't offered to jump back across the border since the end of the Liberation War, have they?

Well most of us were farmers back then but a lot of our military success was in strategy and commitment. Most of the skill was received from german military training during the WWI.

I am quite sure that there was a mass shooting in Finland (if not quite the scale of the recent one in Norway) that had numerous young people killed.

Actually there were 2 of them. Both killed around 10.
The gun laws are stricter now and we also focus on the mental side a lot more. People who want to kill other people will find a way to do it if they really want to. What we should do is to try and stop them from wanting it. (Yes I know easier said than done)

Each country has its own culture, and that is ok with me. Americans will never give up their guns- no way that will happen without another civil war. If the Finns wish to stay largely disarmed, then that is their business, and I respect that, even if I do not agree personally.

Well no one needs a gun in here. Yet the american culture in the early days was every man for himself and every single human being had to protect his ownings. In here it was indeed a bit similar but difference was that around here people weren't threatned in a same way. Everyone kept to his own woods and never came out.

[BBBBBBBBB]

Back into the fire I will have my fork
It won against one knife but not the total drawer
Dishcloths will wipe out the dynasty of spoon
The stainless steel can't hold the cutting board

WE WILL FLY TO THE EMPIRE OF STEEL TONGS
TO DISCOVER THE SECRET OF SPORKS
AND AGAINST THE BLACK KNIFE OF THE FRY PAN
WE'LL USE WHISKS TO DEFEND CASSEROLES

You hate the fry pan as I do now don't deny
Give me the power to show you that I am right
With potato peelers I'll fry free
from soapy sink drains to 'tater peels

WE WILL FLY TO THE EMPIRE OF STEEL TONGS
TO DISCOVER THE SECRET OF SPORKS
AND AGAINST THE BLACK KNIFE OF THE FRY PAN
WE'LL USE WHISKS TO DEFEND OUR TOAAAST

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[miditek]

There is at least one major population center- Helsinki, right? Also, you don't have to live in a population center to encounter predators of other types- wildlife, for instance. I am sure that there are bear, boar, and other forms of animals that you wouldn't necessarily want to run up on.

Well Wolves, Lynxes and Wolverines are close to extinction here and the most dangearous being left are actually Elks along with bears. There are lots of elks and they are a great danger to traffic. Bears however try to stay away from humans as long as possible. Bears kill statistically 1-2 people in every 50 years. Then we also have one type of rattlesnake but it is not very poisonous.

It's possible that there are fewer numbers of predatory species in Finland, and in addition to the population being widely dispersed, I can see your point. Bear attacks in America can happen anywhere, or most anywhere at least. There was a terrible episode about five or six years ago at Chilhowee Lake (Southeast TN) where a seven year old little girl was attacked and eaten by a black bear, and her family was helpless to stop the attack. There have been other attacks in California recently, but some of the worst can happen in Alaska, where the Kodiak and Grizzly bears are enormous.

The pop-culture term 'loaded for bear' comes from the fact that many standard weapons, such as a 9mm or .45 caliber handgun would do little if anything to help stave off a bear attack- particularly if it is a sow with her cubs, which would naturally provoke her. Around here, the bare minimum recommended sidearm for defense against bear would be a .44 Magnum with specialized soft-point rounds at 340 gr. The best overall defense for bear though would be a 12 gauge shotgun with the 'slug' type of rounds.

Out West or in Alaska, it goes up to a .500 S&W cartridge due to the larger bears. Of course, a .44 Magnum or .500 S&W wouldn't be the best type of round for defense against snakes. A .38 S&W or .357 with snake-shot is best to deal with rattlers or Copperheads that get too close. Smart deer hunters will have some carrying anti-bear rounds, and others in the group will carry snake-shot.

Bear are not the only predator in my area, there are also coyotes, wolves, wild boar (which are very dangerous), bobcats, mountain lions, and other assorted creatures that are best left alone, but I would not want to go into a National Forest around here unarmed.

Well there is a lot of discussion going on about should we try to keep the whole country populated as a lot of people are moving to cities. Farming is not the best way to make a living in a country with such winters. Yet to think of the scale of ours cities... Tokyo for example has almost three times the population of Finland in it.

I can see where there would be some interest in getting the country to be more urban, but isn't it likely that at least some of the Finns would rather stay in the smaller towns and villages?

I am quite sure that there is probably some sort of hunting culture in Finland- otherwise, they would not have beaten the Russians down as badly as they did during WWII. The Finns obviously knew how to hunt, how to fish, how to shoot, and moreover, knew their terrain rather well. The Russians haven't offered to jump back across the border since the end of the Liberation War, have they?

Well most of us were farmers back then but a lot of our military success was in strategy and commitment. Most of the skill was received from german military training during the WWI.

I can see where the Germans could have helped with military training, and apparently that training was passed down to the younger generations that fought in the three Finnish wars during WWII. Nevertheless, the Finn's martial abilities have typically been respected in the West, and particularly in America.

I am quite sure that there was a mass shooting in Finland (if not quite the scale of the recent one in Norway) that had numerous young people killed.

Actually there were 2 of them. Both killed around 10. The gun laws are stricter now and we also focus on the mental side a lot more. People who want to kill other people will find a way to do it if they really want to. What we should do is to try and stop them from wanting it. (Yes I know easier said than done)

If stricter guns laws have helped in Finland, then that is a good thing. However, strict gun laws do not always necessarily equate with lower crime rates- the cities of Washington, D.C. (where the crime rates are a national disgrace), Baltimore, Chicago, New York, and other places still have plenty of problems with crime, despite having some of the most restrictive gun laws in the nation.

Each country has its own culture, and that is ok with me. Americans will never give up their guns- no way that will happen without another civil war. If the Finns wish to stay largely disarmed, then that is their business, and I respect that, even if I do not agree personally.

Well no one needs a gun in here.

That is a decision that the Finns themselves have to make, and I respect the fact that Finland is a sovereign nation, with its own government and laws.

Yet the american culture in the early days was every man for himself and every single human being had to protect his ownings.

Guns are still very prevalent in our culture, and your assessment is at least partially correct. Men had to protect their belongings. They also had to defend their families from outlaws, but the true spirit of the Constitution, and indeed the American Revolution itself lies in the fact that the people are the ones that have the power, and the 2nd Amendment is much more about having the power (firepower) to "throw out the government" if it begins to move against the people. It's hard to play genocidal games with a population that is literally armed to the teeth.

In here it was indeed a bit similar but difference was that around here people weren't threatned in a same way. Everyone kept to his own woods and never came out.

That sounds like a great place to live, and it's too bad that there are not more areas like that around here. Granted, there are some places where people keep to themselves and leave each other alone, but places such as that are starting to disappear over here.

[Arnold Layne]

They always try to ban guns, but never violence. HUH! It does not make sense.

Arnold Layne

[AGAG]

What if we ban all Burger Kings from England?