Helloween Guitarrists

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Who's the best Helloween Guitarrist of all times

Kai Hansen
33
53%
Michael Weikath
11
18%
Roland Grapow
8
13%
Sascha Gerstner
10
16%
 
Total votes: 62

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by hiro23 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 2:16 am

I think I'm misunderstood in my point, I'm not saying Kiske's stuff sucks, it's just my personal opinion that his stuff hasn't been as successful as the other members and ex-members of helloween and that he has a very arrogant attitude when it comes to music. Mind you this is only my opinion and it's fine if no one agree's with it, it's just the situation as I see it.
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by icecab21 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 3:05 am

I know you aren’t saying it sucks or anything, I was going off a different point. Kiske has developed his attitude partly in response to the aggressiveness that people have towards him from some people in the metal community. From the interviews that I have read I like him a lot and think he can over generalize but mainly is just speaking for himself and how he wants to live and how he responds to music.

As for kiske and success, I don't think commercial success is really something he has been going for. He is more in demand that the other guys for projects and more people list him in their influences than list Hanson or deris. Kiske has not even performed live since 93. The guy does not really seem band friendly as he just records his stuff and sends it in online.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Ragehead91 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 3:12 am

I don't it is a big surprise that I don't like Kiskes stuff. Much like Tolkki's solo albums his stuff just bores me. But I have to say that Place Vendome isn't that bad. It is actually very decent. Especially the last album.

And hiro is right. The only reason why Kiske gets still mentioned nowdays is that he was Helloween singer. He doesn't get too much praise for his solo stuff, which is justified in my opinion since he apart from the two Place Vendome albums the guy hasn't released anything worthwhile. And I never thought that someone could take songs from Chameleon and make them even worse than they already are. But Kiske managed to do just that with his "The Past in Different Ways" album.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by icecab21 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 3:32 am

I think his solo albums are great for the genre that they are. He just does not promote his material at all in that market. I can definitely see his songs on the radio if he wanted them there in those markets.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by hiro23 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 4:14 am

Okay so I guess it's safe to say that we all like Kiske's voice, just not his attitude towards metal.
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Ragehead91 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 7:37 am

Yes. Although I still thing he is overrated, his voice is good.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by hiro23 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 7:58 am

Ragehead:I also share that opinion

Icecab:I will give credit where it's due, most of the stuff Kiske does is very good, I just feel that Andi was a better choice for the band is all.
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Ragehead91 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 8:01 am

Andi Deris WAS the best choice for the band and you simply can't deny that. Can you imagen where Helloween would be now if they chose the Kiske-root and released more albums in the vain of Chameleon? Propably the band would be dead by now. That horrible Chameleon album nearly destroyed all the credibility that those guys had. And now imagine 2 or more albums of that kind. Bah.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by hiro23 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:41 am

They definitely would not have stayed metal that's for sure, Master of the rings was the album that put them back on the path they'd started in the 80's
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Babylon » Sat Jun 20, 2009 7:07 pm

hiro23 wrote:They definitely would not have stayed metal that's for sure, Master of the rings was the album that put them back on the path they'd started in the 80's
Oh yea, MOR was like this huge punch in the face, come back album. I don't HATE Chameleon, but definitely my least favorite one (tho I think Giants is a great song). On the interview for the expanded edition, Weiki says it was more like 3 solo albums in one, which makes a lot of sense.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Ragehead91 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 7:09 pm

Babylon wrote:
hiro23 wrote:They definitely would not have stayed metal that's for sure, Master of the rings was the album that put them back on the path they'd started in the 80's
Oh yea, MOR was like this huge punch in the face, come back album. I don't HATE Chameleon, but definitely my least favorite one (tho I think Giants is a great song). On the interview for the expanded edition, Weiki says it was more like 3 solo albums in one, which makes a lot of sense.
I wouldn't say that MOR was that big comeback. The true comback to me was The Time of The Oath. MOR was sort of back to the roots but not really at the top of their game like album.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by hiro23 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 8:17 pm

Ragehead:infinitly better then Chameleon though
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Ragehead91 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 8:28 pm

Indeed. Sorry, but in my opinion Chameleon was just horrible. But then again, being better than Chameleon is not that hard :lol:

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by hiro23 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 8:37 pm

Well I don't think Chameleon was a horrible album, there are a good amount of decent songs on it, I do like songs like "first time" and "Giants", it's just that it was very clear that Kiske was trying to put them more into the pop catagory and Weikath knew that they needed a change.

I like MOTR about the same as I like Time of the oath, I think both albums have a ton of catchy songs on them, one of the songs I practice is "where the rain grows"
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Ragehead91 » Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:03 pm

My favourite song from MoTR would be "Perfect Gentleman"

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by stratoplayer » Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:21 pm

hiro23 wrote:Okay so I guess it's safe to say that we all like Kiske's voice, just not his attitude towards metal.
The German Axl Rose, nowhere near as huge a prick though.
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by icecab21 » Sun Jun 21, 2009 2:02 am

I’m going over chameleon; I have to say I love it. Of course I also love the genres that they mix into the music. I do think kiske should have started another band for that though.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by hiro23 » Sun Jun 21, 2009 9:09 pm

Icecab:I agree, chameleon is a good album, just not for Helloween, if another band had done it I would have no problem however the sound was just a little too different for me, don't get me wrong there are still plenty of songs from that album that I listen to, however I was glad when Deris came and they went back to doing more of the metal stuff.
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by icecab21 » Sun Jun 21, 2009 9:28 pm

I think if a band is together with their decision to experiment like that than good, I don't think bands should be tied to fans and I think the album has balls for being so out of the box. Since in this case it was ripping the band apart that makes me think the band made the best they could after the album by having a new vocalist and all. I have to say I think crazy cat is one sexy song with 50s rock and metal mixed into it. I would love some bands combining those styles. The combining of styles is something that I really love about rough silk. The band has some power metal songs that are combined with southern rock slide guitar and gospel organ and more.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by hiro23 » Sun Jun 21, 2009 9:34 pm

Icecab:and that's fine, I'm just saying that it's not really my preference.
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by icecab21 » Sun Jun 21, 2009 9:41 pm

:) yes that is what you are saying.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Ragehead91 » Sun Jun 21, 2009 9:43 pm

I have to disagree. I don't really like those experiments and style changes since most of the time they end up disappointing me. Helloween 1991-1992, Edguy since 2006, Metallica everything from Load to St. Anger and the list goes on. If it's not broken, why fix it?

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by hiro23 » Mon Jun 22, 2009 9:36 pm

Actually I loved Pink bubbles go ape, I think that album has a ton of great songs on it, Chameleon was just a little too different for me.

I think when it comes to experimenting some bands hit it right on the mark and some others don't quite nail it. Some bands have made great progress when it comes to experimenting, take for example Pink Floyd, they experiment on every album they do and usually hit the mark quite well.
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Ragehead91 » Mon Jun 22, 2009 9:40 pm

It always depends. But still, when it's not broke, why fix it? Why change a winning formula? It worked for AC/DC, Motörhead and a lot of other bands.

A Stylechange I forgot:
In Flames everything from Reroute to Remain onward. Who had the fucking idea to make a Metalcore Band out of those guys?

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by hiro23 » Mon Jun 22, 2009 9:47 pm

I guess it depends on the band, some bands are perfectly fine with doing it the same way every time however other bands want to see if they can stretch the borders a bit and get more room to work in.

I like both kinds of bands, I too am a person who likes to experiment with music a little, don't worry I won't go away from my root sound however I would like to try some new things.
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Ragehead91 » Mon Jun 22, 2009 9:52 pm

Well, I guess I would be the oppisite. I'm not saying experiments are a bad thing, but for me most of the experiments I've hard disappointed me. Of course there are experiments and stylechanges that I like (Rage starting to work with an Orchestra, Whitesnake going for a much heavier sound by the end of the 80s,...) but overall there were more misses than there wre hits for me.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Babylon » Fri Jun 26, 2009 4:03 am

Ragehead91 wrote:It always depends. But still, when it's not broke, why fix it? Why change a winning formula? It worked for AC/DC, Motörhead and a lot of other bands.

A Stylechange I forgot:
In Flames everything from Reroute to Remain onward. Who had the fucking idea to make a Metalcore Band out of those guys?
Oh yea In Flames... RTR I still liked but I wish they'd stayed more in the vein of Clayman...

I like to see a little experimenting/change. For some bands it works to re-do the same album over and over, but it gets boring at some point. I have a lot of respect for those bands who stay true to their style and yet don't re-do the same album. Probably the reason why I love Helloween, Iron Maiden and Stratovarius so much.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by Ragehead91 » Fri Jun 26, 2009 4:21 am

It seems to me like they get their motivation from Sonic Syndicate. Another Swedish Melo Death Metal band that had one decent album and then turned into Metalcore/Emocore crap.

Yes. If you overlock the Chameleon, Helloween has yet to dissapoint me. Yeah, I said I didn't really like PBGA and RDCE, but they're both not as bad as Chameleon IMO.

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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by hiro23 » Fri Jun 26, 2009 7:29 am

Ragehead:it seems to me what you like is when a band doesn't turn too much away from it's root sound, if that's the case I agree.

I do see what you mean about a band sticking with a formula however in my opinion if you do the same thing every time it does get boring.

But I do agree that doing a complete 180 is not what a band should do.
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Re: Helloween Guitarrists

Post by icecab21 » Fri Jun 26, 2009 7:55 am

i think a band should just do what it wants and deal with the results.

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