Stratovarius Community

Equinox asked it from me on MSN. He said yes, I said no.
Ohh, and reasons are welcome.

I agree with Equinox...

Exists the possibility...

What can I say? It is yes for our (life)time but it will be a no some years from now.
The Arctic ice is melting, because the temperature is rising, which is primarily caused by humans hands.With the ice melting the sea level increases, but that is another problem.
With the molten ice, the gulf stream(which starts from the gulf of mexico) loses its ability to bring the warm waters up to north Europe(Scandinavia,England, etc)This will cause temperature to fall greatly in all of Europe apart from the north.
Scientists have discovered that the gulf stream is already weakining...
Confused you? Sorry.
Well I'll say that it is true, since what happens in our time should be important...

stratobabius wrote:What can I say? It is yes for our (life)time but it will be a no some years from now.
The Arctic ice is melting, because the temperature is rising, which is primarily caused by humans hands.With the ice melting the sea level increases, but that is another problem.
With the molten ice, the gulf stream(which starts from the gulf of mexico) loses its ability to bring the warm waters up to north Europe(Scandinavia,England, etc)This will cause temperature to fall greatly in all of Europe apart from the north.
Scientists have discovered that the gulf stream is already weakining...
Confused you? Sorry.
Well I'll say that it is true, since what happens in our time should be important...

I DO NOT agree with global warming. I think it's just a stupid theory. A science fiction theory. That's all.
The arctic ice is melting, right. Now, who says that gw's fault?
"The ice caps in Mars are melting, now which company should we blame?"

Fuck, I'm all confused with this pool....Beast_Pete.
I meant to vote: "Yes, it's a lie"

It is only something that will not last long(Only 100-200 years)! And I don't blame one exact person or company or country...

stratobabius wrote:It is only something that will not last long(Only 100-200 years)! And I don't blame one exact person or company or country...

1.What?

2. Ok, nothing specific, but u're blaming humans. Are there humans in Mars?

I'll write what I believe. After this period of melting and stuff, everything is going to get really icy around here!
Maybe its the circle of nature I don't know...
About Mars, who knows what happened and it looks like this today.
But, let's stick on Earth, ok?

Since one can allready clearly see the effects of the global warming here in north, I say that it is happening, our winter comes at later date, the christmas is usually lame (by my book, it should be freezing like lower levels in Dante's Inferno like it was in my childhood ) the real winter comes around January, and that is wasy too late in my opinnion... and there are few other things too minor to mention here... ok, I just say it's true, and that's got to be enough

Who knows. I know the world won't end in a way caused by global warming.

Exactly. I have the problem with winter too. It used to come in the early november, but now... is there winter at all? This winter was the first real winter for about 10 years! But it's still not the same as before, as it arrived in the middle of december, and the snow melted, then cam another winter in the first half of january with big snow. Now it was fucking cold, without snow. Is that normal? Nope. We used to have a lot of snow with temperature around -10 celsius.

And also, the summer is not as long as it used to be. There isn't as much rain in the Fall as it used to be.

So I say, this is true, there is global warming up.

I believe it is true because the weather has changed drasticly over the past decades---I have lived through 4, so I know what I am talking about! When I was in kid in te late 60s we had to wear heavy coats in October--now we do not have to wear heavy coats at all except at night in Janusry&February. In the daytime in most cases, a sweater will suffice. And right now it is supposed to be the coldest part of Winter, even in the South--but we are experiencing 60-70 degreeF. days. It gets cold at night-30s-but, no forecast for colder daytime temps for the next week or so.
The point is---the climate has changed where I live so much that if it keeps doing so, by the time my son reaches my age he will be growing oranges&lemons in our backyard with no prob at all!!!

So, yes, I think something is happening here!!!

wow, I do not understand how somebody can doubt that human's influence has a negative effect on climate! Wake up, guys!! We are ruining this planet!!!!! Of course one can argue about what's the special causes and what's the effects in every single case (e.g. carbondioxid), but it's obvious, it has been prooved by many studies and it's a damned fucking fact that we cannot go on like this cuz the earth heats up (it would also heat up without humans, but not as drastically as nowadays). No matter in what country you live, you cannot deny that the poles are melting, that life conditions change merciless for millions of people and animals all around the world.

Oh, by the way: There has been written a lot of trash about global warming, on both sides (doubters and advocates of the theory), but scientific studies exist about that thing! You cannot say it's just science fiction! It's happening - and it will be even more dramatical!!!

It has to be true... Just look our winters for example. Nowadays - as Kain already mentioned - the real winter comes here around late January or even in February, excepting only some exceptions like the very cold season few weeks ago or the first cold days in late October usually. Normally it´s just a bit cold, then again + degrees, cold, then warmer again till Christmas, and even more around 0 celsius weather in January too. I still remember when I was a child it was very strict winters nearly every year even around here in the south. After those years we´ve had only 4 more strict winters here (in ~20 years ).

Also I´ve noticed it´s getting nowadays more windy than before, and it can come bad storms over here more often. So, the climate must be changing...

Right, climate's changing, but who says that's because of us? Weren't there a Ice Age long ago? Yes.

(t would also heat up without humans, but not as drastically as nowadays).

And how many degreesF do u call drastical? .8? 'cuz that's how warmer earth has become...in the past...what? since the 1800s.

it has been prooved by many studies and it's a damned fucking fact that we cannot go on like this cuz the earth heats up

Funny, it has been proved that the facts created by a computer models are wrong, why's that? 'cuz it just a guess. Not even an educated guess.
And: http://www.sepp.org/pressrel/petition.html

And like I said before, there has been many changes in weather over time, so, we can't blame humans, just because it's happening now. It's not the first time.

It's -27 degrees now. I think it's lie...

Equinox wrote:Right, climate's changing, but who says that's because of us? Weren't there a Ice Age long ago? Yes.

(t would also heat up without humans, but not as drastically as nowadays).

And how many degreesF do u call drastical? .8? 'cuz that's how warmer earth has become...in the past...what? since the 1800s.

it has been prooved by many studies and it's a damned fucking fact that we cannot go on like this cuz the earth heats up

Funny, it has been proved that the facts created by a computer models are wrong, why's that? 'cuz it just a guess. Not even an educated guess.
And: http://www.sepp.org/pressrel/petition.html

And like I said before, there has been many changes in weather over time, so, we can't blame humans, just because it's happening now. It's not the first time.

I'm not a scientist. And I don't believe something just because I read an article about it. But if you take this thing so seriously you should have seen statistic and computer models about how climate is changing on this planet, how it has changed before without mankind's influence and how it should change now. And these show that what's happening nowadays and what has happened in the past century was far out of periodical order.

I can get so angry about such discussions. Even if global warming is exaggerated, it's so obvious that we - mankind - are disturbing the natural balance that has kept things going on this planet over thousands of years. We are harming nature, and we are harming ourselves! If you stick only to the global warming thing, well, as I said, I'm not a scientist, and all those people could be wrong. But in general we have to change our course!! Thank God that there are many other people who think this way - Stratovarius is the best proof.

No matter what is causing it, the change is happening! So what if the global temp has only changed .8 degree....that's probably all it takes to upset the rhythm of the climates. I just know because like I said, in the 60s the temperatures WERE different! The other day I was wearing cut-off shorts--in JANUARY!!! Now, thats something! A couple weeks ago we had a cold snap&that is the extent of our cold weather here---if we do not get some ice or below freezing temps this month---I'm gonna really know something is going on!
Mother Gaia is pissed&she is rebelling the only way she knows how. She is trying to balance the climate lby causing these flutuations. Mankind is doing lots of damage to the ecosystem, destroying the rainforests, more population means more cars, and many countries are putting out pollutants at an astonishing rate. I say if we do not change--we are Fucked! Maybe not in our lifetime--but, our kinds&grandkids may suffer.

Ok, one more point:
New Orleans
destoyed utterly 'couse of global warming, the hurricanes wouldn't be that strong without the global warming I am still quite amused that US goverment was to take a big part of the hit of their very own decicion of not joining Kioto and still polluting like hell no offense to anyone from US in here, but you'r country is the single most effective pollution producer in this planet thank the raving madman holding the chair of your presidency for that

There have already been predictions from the experts that next hurricane season is going to be even worse&longer than the last! So, hold on to yours hats--we are all going on a rough ride!!!!

And, I sure did not help elect that Bozo--I'm a liberal!
Oh, in my country's defense---China is the biggest producer of pollutants, and its from all those factories producing all those wonderful gadgets we seem to cannot live without!

i don't know of it's real or sci-fi theory, but if you are looking for someone to blame, blame the Devil, that never fails

Nevertheless, i believe some day nature is going to kick our asses

stratohawk wrote:wow, I do not understand how somebody can doubt that human's influence has a negative effect on climate! Wake up, guys!! We are ruining this planet!!!!!

We have been absolutely shitin' over the earth for millions of years, and by shittin' i mean devastating. Climate is not only a result of the potential harm we've caused, but also animal extinction. In certain ways, we have also caused involution and mutations in small groups of forms of life.
I truly believe in the butterfly effect theory, and if we are not responsable in certain ways, then i don't know who's fault is, fate? ants? Dave? the Devil?

I also understand Equinox, humans might not be 100% responsable of gw, but we are in 70% for sure. If this is not our whole fault, then it's also true that we are not helping that much to prevent an "inminent" catastrophe.

browneyedgirl wrote:There have already been predictions from the experts that next hurricane season is going to be even worse&longer than the last! So, hold on to yours hats--we are all going on a rough ride!!!!

And, I sure did not help elect that Bozo--I'm a liberal!
Oh, in my country's defense---China is the biggest producer of pollutants, and its from all those factories producing all those wonderful gadgets we seem to cannot live without!

So the predictions go and it's going to have even stronger hurricanes than Rita and few other last year's gifts from mother gaia

That's good for you, BEG

Oh, but China had somewhat better explanation than you did not to join Kioto as I recall Bush was short in his words, and said that "we pollute as much as we want" perhaps in a bit prettier words but that's what he said darn that texas' oil-freak (btw, everyone who hates him, should watch A Perfect Circle's music video Counting Bodies Like Sheep To The Rythm Of The War Drums made by americans in US, and the greatest anti-Bush video I have ever seen ) No offence still, but would US join the Kioto contract, the global pollution would drop dramatically that would slow down the process of those hurricanes becoming ever stronger

browneyedgirl wrote:There have already been predictions from the experts that next hurricane season is going to be even worse&longer than the last! So, hold on to yours hats--we are all going on a rough ride!!!!

And, I sure did not help elect that Bozo--I'm a liberal!
Oh, in my country's defense---China is the biggest producer of pollutants, and its from all those factories producing all those wonderful gadgets we seem to cannot live without!

China's going to be the world superpower soon. Scary.

Well.. I read in the World Bank Report 2003 that the global temperature is expected to be rising for about 6°C until 2100 - if we don't push te weel. The World Bank should be credible enough, I don't believe they release uncertified statements. So: We should start to act now, or our children will get wet feets - or much worse.

Global warming is scientifically proven. The more CO2 we pump into the atmosphere, and the faster we cut down trees, the higher the temperature gets.

This is pure, hard, scientific FACT.

Yes, Global Warming is TRUE and we'd better start looking after our home a bit better or else we'll all be in DEEP trouble.

I cannot see how someone can deny global warming when EVERY scientist says that it is a fact (except those paid by oil companies and the US government, of course.)

I don't think the question should be "does global warming exist?" The question ought to be "does all that crap we spew onto this earth have an impact on the environment?" To which the answer is obviously "well, duh!" One can debate how this impact manifests itself, but the point is that it's foolish to believe it's not going to come back and bite us in the ass down the line. Perhaps sooner than later.
"A lie"? What an odd way to put it. There's a significant amount of scientists who do believe global warming as a man-made phenomenon exists, and there are those who doesn't. No one is "lying", it's a matter of disagreement over how to interpret the existing data.

You know, I have never heard Bush come out and say "We pollute as much as we want". I think it might have been interesting to hear the two sentences that proceeded that statement, as well as the two that followed it. Sounds like someone clipped that sound byte to get it to sound just the way you depicted it. I follow the news pretty close, never heard that. Amazing. Bush certainly isn't the greatest president we have ever had, but there are an awful lot of lies and mis-truths spread about him. A lie gets half way around the world before the truth even has a chance to put it's boots on.


That said. I don't know if global warming is actually happening or not. I do know this though, a cleaner environment is far preferable to one that isn't. My biggest thing is finding a practical, reliable, CLEANER alternative for oil. I don't care who does it, but it needs to be done, for so many reasons. Pres Bush paid lip service to this last night, lets see if he actually makes good on it.


Jesse

Equinox wrote:

stratobabius wrote:It is only something that will not last long(Only 100-200 years)! And I don't blame one exact person or company or country...

1.What?

2. Ok, nothing specific, but u're blaming humans. Are there humans in Mars?

what??

Now I got completely lost

Come on you people. Global warming is a fact.

@equi: I believe that Ice Ages come periodically.
People aren't 100% blamed for this, but you can't say it is not our fault. We have at least hastened this 'thing' happening! And I don't say that we are the ones to blame, Do you know that cows help with methane pollution by about 5%?(And they are just cows...)