downloading..

[STRATOPHILIUS]

...why I should wait for album release and then buy it and listen to it?...when I'm really into this music I want hear it as soon as it is possible...its natural so why not to download it before it si in stores and then buy itif it is worth to buy.

Dude you are the people who are screwing up this world...listen to you...you don't have any patience or restraint at all....its all I want that, and I want it now...and the fact about not having enough money to buy cd's I can understand but you dont just jack them becuase like you said you live in a small country and lets think about it how likely is stratovarius to play there often??...probably not very so theres little you can do to make up for not paying for their music....if you cant afford a Cd then why dont you save up money...you have 3 months...is it really that hard?...plus this makes that cd more valuable to you and closer to your heart if you had to suffer to get it... all great things in life dont come easy....so in reality your just cheating yourself

[Beast_Pete]

The person above me is right. That is the beauty in waiting. It really worths.

[Stealth]

Jens, the idea of theft is a relative one. Strato CDs here in Canada cost $30, and there's absolutely no way to justify that price, even with the production, recording, promotion, etc. Recordable CDs cost anywhere between 25-50 cents, so obviously, the actual making of CDs is not expensive. Other CDs (pop music, classical music, etc.) sell for much less, but metal CDs are really expensive. For one of my birthdays I got your album "The Last Viking", which I love. Do you know how much it costs? $65. It is the Japanese version, but then again, it is the ONLY version available here. Those prices are just insane, there's no discussion about it. Not even a top notch recording of a classical masterpiece costs that much. Now that's what I call theft. The only thing left for me to think is that the record companies truly takes us for fools. They really believe we are idiots, but in the end, they are hurting themselves as much as they hurt us, because with those prices, I'd rather download, and if we download, they get no money. And if Strato decides not to play in certain countries because they don't sell CDs and people download music, fine, some fans might not be able to see Strato live, but they can still get Strato's CDs, so from an economic point of view, in many cases at least, it is Strato's loss. If, for example, Strato were to decide not to play in Brazil, that decision would certainly not hurt the Brazilian's fan pocket. I really can't afford to buy CDs at such high prices, especially considering that I don't only listen to Strato. So, record companies try to take advantage of those who buy CDs, and fans take advantage of the available technology, which seems like a pretty good way of fighting back. And don't give that romantic speech about fans having to buy CDs in order to support the band. Yes, I wouldn't mind supporting the band at all, in fact, I would gladly do it, but under the right circumstances. Besides, we have to support the band, but what is the band doing in order to promote lower prices that would make their CDs readily available to many fans? And yes, we get to this conclusion: The band doesn't have to support the fans, after all, they are the ones writing the music... But guess what, the fans don't have to support the band unconditionally either. The band might choose not to have a discussion with the record company in order to do something about those fucked up prices, and the fans might choose not to pay insane amounts of money for something that's not worth it from any perspective.

Oh, and just like in Sweden, downloading in Canada is not illegal, sharing is.

[EricAdams]

Sorry guys, but I am not listening only to Stratovarius so as you, so dont tell me how and for what to save money...I know how to save my money but there are another reasons for what I must save them. And as I wrote soon or later I'll buy Strato albums but first the oldest and later new ones...
And I really dont think that it is about patience to wait for release or not, if you want to wait so wait, if not download it and buy later. Its only your choice so don't criticize my.
I dont want in my response to regret self or us form "little country". I want only to point out that not everyone who is downloading is thief...nothing more nothing less.
And you think that bands come to your country because you are buying theier CDs?...it is also about support and fans, about atmosphere and also work of concert organizators who brings the band to your country. I think Stratovarius enjoyed to play in Slovakia and come back soon. And maybe after some years I could also buy CD for one hour salary....

and rather let's talk about music:)...its better topic and our views are maybe more similar

Have a Nice Day

[JensJohansson]

I want only to point out that not everyone who is downloading is thief...nothing more nothing less.

Theft is what society decides it to be. So of course it's theft. But a very small one compared to some other kinds of theft! Of course there is theft and there is theft.

And you think that bands come to your country because you are buying theier CDs?...it is also about support and fans, about atmosphere and also work of concert organizators who brings the band to your country. I think Stratovarius enjoyed to play in Slovakia and come back soon. And maybe after some years I could also buy CD for one hour salary....

Yes, if the atmosphere is as nice as Slovakia we will come there even if people are downloading. Also I think we sold a lot of tickets there!? To me more people mean better atmosphere!! Up until maybe 6-7000 people. Then as you move up in venue size the atmosphere starts to suffer a bit. Not to mention the sounds (some concrete ice hall or something)

I think biggest possible "perfect" venue is somehow like 4 or 5000 people.

I think anyway that most that could be said has been said here.

[JensJohansson]

It is the very first time ( except Metalicrap ) that I read that a band of that size is fuckin' up with downloaders.... Ok it is not a really good way to encourage artists but !

We're not relally fucking with them, just basically collecting the info. The main reason to get a breakdown by country. Screw the other shit i talked about. Too much work..

Not going to countries because they are downloading too much ? Well, it's better for you not to know which country downloads 'cause you'll make fans unhappy and unhappy fans know how to boycott !

I'm thinking only about the practice to play at a loss in some place! To play at a profit makes economical sense (of course.) Sorry all this shit talk about economics but "money => we can make even more music." I didn't get into this to buy fancy cars or gourmet food. I still take the subway and eat junk food. The only reason I'm talking about money is because money is a tool that enables us to make more music =)

it really discourages me to see that you want downloaders to fuck off, downloaders are fans ! I can understand that you want money and you don't want to feel like you did all this new job for nothing but...Fuck it and live !

I think you'll note that I said no such thing. I just called them "thieves" and said that they are shitting on our rights. Both those things are true (well the latter in a more metaphorical sense.)

If you don't want to play a gig, well what are you doing in a band ?

Maximizing the amount of future music to be made. If you understood it you would understand it. If you don't understand it you don't understand it.

[JensJohansson]

A question: how can you know it for sure, that the IP and the ISP of a forumposter matches the downloader?

Just an example: a fan from Finland posts here. He has an IP 80.34.127.20 on one of the days, when he posts to this forum. And his ISP is the XYZ company. And there's someone, who downloads your new album, with the same IP and ISP (well, the chances are very little, but could happen) but on another day.

Of course it should be a visit and download at the same time!

But yes, your instinct here is correct, the issue then becomes what "simultaeous" means. I'd say you use a 20 minute window maybe.

I thought about it like this:

a) make one table with timestamps and ip numbers of downloads, and another of timestamps / ip numbers / poster name of posts.

b) find the rows in the two tables where the ip numbers match each other and the difference between the timestamps is not larger than some number 'W'.

For a 20 minute window W would be 1200 seconds..

I'm not gonna bother...

[JensJohansson]

Kazaa Media Desktop's license agreement prohibits users from monitoring traffic or making search requests in order to accumulate information about individual users.

Of course I don't use Kazaa so none of this would even apply to me in theory!! Kazaa supposedly sucks ass nowadays anyway. Probably because it was simple to break the hashing.

The OpenBSD and perl licenses definitely lets you do whatever you want with that software. Which is great.

Yeah, Sharman didn't like their spyware removed. Boo hoo fucking hoo!

[JensJohansson]

Yes the thing about static ips is that they are given out randomly and then swapped out to someone else. For instance, a person on dial up in the US logs onto the net and posts on a message board about racecars, then they log off the net. The next person logs on the net in Mexico, YES an entirely DIFFERENT country, and can post on a message board about Mexican heritage, and have that same EXACT ip address, the very same day.

I'm using GeoIP to even make a stab at guessing the country. Yes, who knows how accurate it is