Stratovarius Community

I know that it's getting more and more warmer, but we should also remember that the next VERY COLD era (I mean, half of the earth or more will freeze, like in 10 000 years ago) is maybe coming soon. In Northern-Europe it's quite possible in the future. It has happen before, and some scientiest thinks that the warm temperature in northern countries will stop. So actually I believe much more to this.

but as far as I know the next Ice Age should already have started. Instead, Earth's heating up, and only if the poles melted down it will get colder, but this has nothing to do with the natural periods with which Ice Ages come and go. This has to do with mankind's influence.

Ice Age: What a kool movie

stratohawk wrote:This has to do with mankind's influence.

No, there was another reason also. Natural.
I can't explain it (at least in english).

htcdude wrote:Ice Age: What a kool movie

You won't be thinking that when temperatures drop to -30 on a regular basis.

If global warming really kicks in, the British Isles will freeze. Ironic, huh.

In my opinion, people telling the Earth is warming are wrong. When you see this wave of cold which invaded Europe some weeks ago and which is continuing to freeze us and to kill people, the logical thought would be that there is another Ice Age which arrives soon. So, Global Warming is not so true. Of course, summers are hot, of course rivers are getting dry, etc, but when you see temperatures now, only a Global Icezation is coming to minds...

MetalAngel wrote:In my opinion, people telling the Earth is warming are wrong. When you see this wave of cold which invaded Europe some weeks ago and which is continuing to freeze us and to kill people, the logical thought would be that there is another Ice Age which arrives soon. So, Global Warming is not so true. Of course, summers are hot, of course rivers are getting dry, etc, but when you see temperatures now, only a Global Icezation is coming to minds...

The reason that Europe will get COLDER if global warming really takes hold is due to the Gulf Stream (a current of warm water in the north Atlantic ocean) will become disrupted and stop bringing warmer air to the continent.

Elsewhere, the temperatures will rise, storms will become more frequent and ferocious (look at the Gulf of Mexico in the summer of 2004, I say no more) and sea levels will rise as the ice sheets melt. Scientists are already very worried about the icecap in Greenland, while large parts of the floating ice shelfs in Antarctia are breaking off.

Global warming is a FACT people. A scientifically proven FACT. Ignore at your peril.

NeonVomit wrote:
Global warming is a FACT people. A scientifically proven FACT. Ignore at your peril.

That is what I wanted to say! Thank you,man!

yes. Dude, how bullheaded people can be. And if the connectin between mankind's influence and global warning can't be proved, that doesn't change a damned thing! We CANNOT go on like this!!
And guys, although Europe is freezing at the moment, you can't say just because of that global warming doesn't exist. Ask all the peoples, the Eskimo tribes what's happening with their environment. The folks in the Sahel zone. In Latin America. We just can't always look what's happening in our own small world, we have to widen our focus.




Tell me can we go on like this?
Everybody is living in a bliss

The hole is getting bigger in the sky
do you know the reason why nobody seems to care
Everything is so well in your life
did you ever give a dime

Look all these things we`ve done
Under the burning Sun
Is this the way to carry on?
So take a look at yourself
And tell me what do you see
A wolf in clothes of the Lamb?

Hell, I'll post more than just one response.

I'm not a scientist. And I don't believe something just because I read an article about it.
But if you take this thing so seriously you should have seen statistic and computer models
about how climate is changing on this planet,how it has changed before without mankind's
influence and how it should change now. And these show that what's happening nowadays and what has
happened in the past century was far out of periodical order.

Then, u are based on pure faith? 'Cuz if so, there's no gonna be any arguiing.
If I'm not wrong, those journals, articles,and studies are there to prove if what we think is right. Meaning, in the real world.
Or if we're just having fantasies. Am I right?

Computer models, of course, we're trusting a prediction. Ok, Now, can a prediction be a proff? No.
Many models have failed to prove, or predict, the climate in the last...what? 15 years?

I can get so angry about such discussions.

Hehe, I notice, but just chill aight? I don't want to find out ur adress and send u a
Freedom Call Cd so u can listen to it, over and over again.

Well, yeah. we are "are disturbing the natural balance that has kept things
going on this planet over thousands of years"

And yes, I think we should change too. That's why I like Strato. But in so many freacking ways...
Don't u think so?

New Orleans destoyed utterly 'couse of global warming,
the hurricanes wouldn't be that strong without the global warming

There are SO many studies and stuff that shows that this is not true. (If u want u can check these:
"Tropical Cyclones and Global Climate Change, from Hedersson-Sellers; Bulletin Of The American Metereological Society from Nicholls Landsea; Etc.)
Ppl are saying that huricanes are becoming stronger right?
Well, check this:http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/pastdec.shtml out and see if there's even a trend. I think not.

I agree with NeonLightkid, Gaia WILL kicks us from our behind, I just hope not to be alive.

We have been absolutely shitin'
over the earth for millions of years, and by shittin' i mean devastating.
Climate is not only a result of the potential harm we've caused,
but also animal extinction.

Uh...animal extinction has not been proved, 'cuz how many species of animals are there in the world?
No one knows for sure. And that well is just a prejudice. 'cuz it's like...u've been robbed, but how
would u know if u didn't know how much u had in ur pockets? It's the same thing. No one knows how many
animals are in the world, no one can accurately say the extinction rate (There is none). Plus, let
us not, blame gw for that, more on the hunters like...umm...Michael Jackson.

China's going to be the world superpower soon. Scary.

Dude, I'm scared of any other superpower, it doesn't matter if it's China, or Turkey, or Venezuela.
It's just plain scary. *Runs towards bathroom to change diaper*

Well.. I read in the World Bank Report 2003
that the global temperature is expected to be rising for about 6°C until 2100

Yeah! I remenber. And I seriosly don't mind for the ppl that will be living in 2100, I think,
That there would be less ppl in the world, therefore, less trouble, I think it would be
better to live in that era, than now.

Global warming is scientifically proven.
The more CO2 we pump into the atmosphere, and the faster we cut down trees, the higher the temperature gets.
This is pure, hard, scientific FACT.
Yes, Global Warming is TRUE and we'd better start looking after our home a bit better or else
we'll all be in DEEP trouble.
I cannot see how someone can deny
global warming when EVERY scientist says that it is a fact
(except those paid by oil companies and the US government, of course.)

It is scientifically proved that gw is not true...too. Ironic no?
Yes, the faster we cut down trees will cause damage. Like acid rain and shit.
I can(or at least try) to deny it, 'cuz I strongly believe in what I've read, in researches, and I'ver
seen many proffs that it's not true, but hell, There are so many points in this issue 'cuz
ppl only know so little about our enviromnet...
'bout the other thing...eh..read the link that I posted in one of my previous post. (Blah.)

NeonVomit wrote:

htcdude wrote:Ice Age: What a kool movie

You won't be thinking that when temperatures drop to -30 on a regular basis.

If global warming really kicks in, the British Isles will freeze. Ironic, huh.

Well then my furry hat will come in handy

No one is "lying",
it's a matter of disagreement over how to interpret the existing data.

I totally agree with u here mate. Nothing else to say.

My biggest thing is finding a practical, reliable, CLEANER alternative for oil.

I think we should not worry about that, after all...I've just have heard that in a couple of states
the use of horses are cars were banned, so..they'll find better...at least, I hope so.

Global warming is a fact.

There are proofs taht it's not.

@Equi: I believe that Ice Ages come periodically.

Me too. In fact, I believe we are coming out of 400-years era called the "little Ice Age" but
When will the next one come.

Stratofanius has a point.

Instead, Earth's heating up,
and only if the poles melted down it will get colder,
but this has nothing to do with the natural periods with which Ice Ages come and go.

Then, shouldn't Earth be getting colder? :S

Elsewhere, the temperatures will rise, storms will become more frequent and ferocious
(look at the Gulf of Mexico in the summer of 2004, I say no more)

http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/pastdec.shtml Nothing else to say.

and sea levels will rise as the ice sheets melt.
Scientists are already very worried about the icecap in Greenland,
while large parts of the floating ice shelfs in Antarctia are breaking off.

Good point.

Sea levels rising's the threat right?
Indeed, they are rising, for the past, 6000 years they have been rising. Since the start of some
Weird era,(Don't recall the name of it.)
Levels are rising at least 4-8 inches every 100 years. It has been a steady rise. Gw?

The reason that Europe will get COLDER if global warming really takes hold is due
to the Gulf Stream (a current of warm water in the north Atlantic ocean)
will become disrupted and stop bringing warmer air to the continent.

The thing is that this patter has been going on for thousands of years, 'cuz it's triggered
roughly every four years, and last about a years. It happened 23 times the last century. For not
Only this century. "So it longprecedes any claim of global warming"(Lomborg..talking 'bout El Niño.)

"The Day After Tomorrow" is not as far-fetched a movie as one might think. Scientist said such phenomenons as in the movie could happen---just as not that fast a rate. It would not be an overnight thing, but one which occurs over several decades.

I've seen that movie. And what happens is that most of the world frezzes. Right?...So, where does the name global WARMING comes from?

Nah, I'm just shitting around.

Equinox wrote:
And yes, I think we should change too. That's why I like Strato. But in so many freacking ways...
Don't u think so?

Of course!

I agree with NeonLightkid, Gaia WILL kicks us from our behind, I just hope not to be alive.

You are kidding, right? Because I cannot believe someone is so egoistic and doesn't think of the following generations.

Uh...animal extinction has not been proved, 'cuz how many species of animals are there in the world?

WHAT THE FUCK?? Of course it has been proved that mankind is exterminating thousands of species! That IS fact, man!!

Yeah! I remenber. And I seriosly don't mind for the ppl that will be living in 2100, I think,
That there would be less ppl in the world, therefore, less trouble, I think it would be
better to live in that era, than now.

I can't believe that. I really can't believe what you've written here. There is enough food and enough space on this earth. For everybody. We just have to be more justice and dispense these goods. And we have to find ways to control the growth of population. You cannot say "ah, come on, climate can change, that will kill one billion people, and this will help our species to survive". That's fucking unhuman.


Damn it, man. Yes, you noticed it correctly, I can get angry about such attitudes.

is it just me or this is the only spamless topic?!?!
god, we are progressing

stratohawk wrote: You are kidding, right? Because I cannot believe someone is so egoistic and doesn't think of the following generations.

U know why's that? 'cuz I think they will be better than us. I think they'll have more contact with nature, and consume, probably yes, more energy, but clean energy.

WHAT THE FUCK?? Of course it has been proved that mankind is exterminating thousands of species! That IS fact, man!!

Indeed manking is killing species, but, is gw killing animals? That was my point.
Didn't I mentioned the hunters in New Jersey?

There is enough food and enough space on this earth. For everybody. We just have to be more justice and dispense these goods. And we have to find ways to control the growth of population. You cannot say "ah, come on, climate can change, that will kill one billion people, and this will help our species to survive". That's fucking unhuman.

I certainly did not say "ah, come on, climate can change, that will kill one billion people, and this will help our species to survive". I said that I think that by the year 2100 there will be less ppl, I did not say climate will kill them.

Damn it, man. Yes, you noticed it correctly, I can get angry about such attitudes.

Then, chill out boy. I ain't here for fighting.

I read somewhere that the temperature was much higher(about 3c) a 1000 years ago than it was today. The temperature fell some 300 years ago, and it is rising now, but still hasn't reached the levels of 1000 A.D.
What you say is correct equi, but I still have some doubts...

About those hurricans, Equi: you showed us a link, where it is prooved, that there are less major hurricans nowdays. But take a look at the years. Every interval is 10 years, only the last one not, which is 4 years...

Equinox wrote:

Damn it, man. Yes, you noticed it correctly, I can get angry about such attitudes.

Then, chill out boy. I ain't here for fighting.

you are right. well, it's all about temper.

stratobabius wrote:What you say is correct equi, but I still have some doubts...

Doubts? I do too, I have my doubts, but hey, it's a really complicated topic, 'cuz the thing is that no-one can predict the climate accurately for more than 10 days ahead. And mankind know so little about nature, and climate....let's take this as an example, no-one knows wheater gw (if it exist) will cause more cloud formation or not. And another issue is politicized science, that is simply dangerous. And other stuff, like the media, rembember the Africans killers bees? They're here, no problem, newly, just 6 years ago, Y2K, nothing happened...so, it's a big mess.

But take a look at the years. Every interval is 10 years, only the last one not, which is 4 years...

U're right. And the chart only goes to 04, we know that we had a pretty busy hurricane era in the past year. We'd need to add those, but, if earth's warming up, is there a trend. Not even in big cities there's a trend of warming. u can check giss.nasa.gov for many cities around the globe.

There are SO many studies and stuff that shows that this is not true. (If u want u can check these:
"Tropical Cyclones and Global Climate Change, from Hedersson-Sellers; Bulletin Of The American Metereological Society from Nicholls Landsea; Etc.)
Ppl are saying that huricanes are becoming stronger right?
Well, check this:http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/pastdec.shtml out and see if there's even a trend. I think not.

Wait a sec, that ends in 2004 so the 2000-decade has gone only 3 years and there is allready 3 major hurricanes that hit you and what about last year? Were there not one but two during the same year of those major (class 3,4 or 5) hurricanes? And mother Gaia has still 5 years to prove that she's angry and they still belive for some stronger hurricanes to kick in in just few years and isn't the season just building up? I think I heard something like that...

Kain´s seventh son wrote:Wait a sec, that ends in 2004 so the 2000-decade has gone only 3 years and there is allready 3 major hurricanes that hit you and what about last year? Were there not one but two during the same year of those major (class 3,4 or 5) hurricanes? And mother Gaia has still 5 years to prove that she's angry and they still belive for some stronger hurricanes to kick in in just few years and isn't the season just building up? I think I heard something like that...

U're right. And the chart only goes to 04, we know that we had a pretty busy hurricane era in the past year. We'd need to add those, but, if earth's warming up, there should be a trend and there is none. Not even in big cities like NYC or Mexico City, where ppl consume a lot of energy, where one should expect to be warmer. You can check that in giss.nasa.gov for many cities around the globe.

Isn't it a trend, that the recent years there are more and more hurricans?

Beast_Pete wrote:Isn't it a trend, that the recent years there are more and more hurricans?

Peter no, there is NO trend. So far, we just have 14 hurricanes, it's half the amount if the decade with more hurricanes since 1851, yes, indeed. But even if in this decade we have more hurricanes that in the past, that would not demostrate ur theory. Just like what happened in the decade of 1941-1950, they had 24 hurricanes, 10 mayor ones. But after that, the average fell; then went down, then down, then down, maybe this decade will be as busy as that one. But still, there is no trend.

[Edit, contradictions. ]

Beast_Pete wrote:Isn't it a trend, that the recent years there are more and more hurricans?

Well, the climate is change because the humanity is Fucking the Nature, When the savage capitalism began and the creation of the first machine " Jenny" the world change, in the moment that the factories started to job the contamination was more bigger and You know the history of the Industrial Revolution...So I Go to the point.

Many years later, still working and creating somethings that Fuc* more the climate than it did in the start of all, and the time Saying us, what consecuencies will come here now?? When the world finally down in the reality tried to stop that and There born the Kioto treaty " The countrys of the world had to down the contamination 5%" but E.E.U.U Didn't want and increase the contamination in 20%...Now the world doesn't want us and cant resist more pollution and that's why the hurricanes and another natural disasters have been stronger and occur more often than before. If we keep this way, the disasters will be even stronger and will occur even more often than now.

Remember, we are starting the 2006, still last 5 years to complete the decade, so there could be more hurricanes in the following years. No one can know that. But, remember Katrina and New Orleans

Beast_Pete wrote:Isn't it a trend, that the recent years there are more and more hurricans?

Well, meteorlogists went through the whole alphabet&part of the Greek alphabet(THAT'S never been done before)naming the Hurricanes, so D_UH it seems to me there are more------or, is it my vivid imagination?

Gosh. Yes, there might be more hurricanes in this decade than any other, so what? There is no trend that more strong hurricanes are happening after the "Industrial Revolution" as Paola said (Where supposedly the whole 'global warming' thing began) Does any of u understand the fuck I'm talking here?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/4698652.stm

I guess the BBC are in on the lie, then

"There's much uncertainty in past reconstructions. You've got to look at the reconstructed data in the past in light of the likely errors that those data have."

U know how hard is to measureold data? I mean...we can say that the US is the best country to get info on...the climate. 'Cuz, even if Europe, or Russia...there are like holes in the whetaer report.

Natural records? Natural Succesion.

If I'm not mistaken, I gave a link, to see the report of many countrys worldwide for the past century.

But hey, I don't want to change ur opinion, I'm not dogmatic. What I'm saying is that it's hard to conclude if it's what's been on TV is right, or it is just another complot...