Finnish press: Hitler song postponed!

[Holy Light]

Nice to see Jens and Timo posting again. I love these guys.

I just got the new Frank Marino and Mahogany Rush double live. So Good!

Can't wait for the new Strato!

[fifthtea_sausage]

I'm really glad that you share our concern to the situation, holy light

I am not supportive of the European facists who restrict free speech. I hope justice prevails and TT can publish his song.

[MaFiaBoY]

I'm really glad that you share our concern to the situation, holy light

I am not supportive of the European facists who restrict free speech. I hope justice prevails and TT can publish his song.

We're all living in Amerika, Amerika ist wunderbach !

[TimoTolkki]

Nice to see Jens and Timo posting again. I love these guys.

I just got the new Frank Marino and Mahogany Rush double live. So Good!

Can't wait for the new Strato!

Juggernaut was a really influential record for me.
A bit too Hendrixy to my style, but Marino was/is a really cool player!

[Holy Light]

Nice to see Jens and Timo posting again. I love these guys.

I just got the new Frank Marino and Mahogany Rush double live. So Good!

Can't wait for the new Strato!

Juggernaut was a really influential record for me.
A bit too Hendrixy to my style, but Marino was/is a really cool player!

Timo, you are a truly an influential player to me. I hope to one day achieve the greatness of yourself. Glad to see you back here! That's very cool that you like some Frank Marino.

[TimoTolkki]

Nice to see Jens and Timo posting again. I love these guys.

I just got the new Frank Marino and Mahogany Rush double live. So Good!

Can't wait for the new Strato!

Juggernaut was a really influential record for me.
A bit too Hendrixy to my style, but Marino was/is a really cool player!

Timo, you are a truly an influential player to me. I hope to one day achieve the greatness of yourself. Glad to see you back here! That's very cool that you like some Frank Marino.

Thank you. I hope one day you achieve and find the greatness of yourself.
I am still searching for it. It is a lifelong process...

[khamael]

it's a really good step to search for! the majority of mankind dont think to such a thing...

[BlackPhoenix]

what's all this shit about a song? Hitler's Mein Kampf is still on sale (I've got a copy at home) to teach what can go wrong if you believe the wrong one. Why is song against bad? It teaches us the same!

Timo, can you post the lyrics of the song so we can see what we are dicussing? I don't like judging before knowing the facts...

[Twilight Legionnaire]

what's all this shit about a song? Hitler's Mein Kampf is still on sale (I've got a copy at home) to teach what can go wrong if you believe the wrong one. Why is song against bad? It teaches us the same!

Timo, can you post the lyrics of the song so we can see what we are dicussing? I don't like judging before knowing the facts...

I'd actually prefer to wait for the song, and judge it when we're able to hear it

[Efenstor]

After watching "Hitler: the Rise of Evil" I've got a sense that Hitler's blame for all that happened was not that serious as everyone used to think. Then after analyzing several other histories similar to the Hitler's (Stalin, Lenin, Mussolini, Mao Tse-tung) I can say that the whole process of downfall was TOTALLY uncontrollable! If it would not be Hitler then someone else.

Do you know what a bifurcation is? In synergetics it's the point of substance reorganization when the environmental conditions reach some critical point. Being a social psychologist I can say that bifurcations move the history forth. Every historical event raises from different reasons not connected with each other, but all of them together change the social environment causing an event to happen.

What were the reasons of the World War I? There were no actual reasons: it looked like the whole world has gone totally mad. What was the matter? That's simple: the human society had began its transition into another stage: informational society. The society where INFORMATION was the most important and influental thing for a being. It was the shock, the real shock of the new discovery for the whole western civilization. It was a social bifurcation. It was the reason for the so many tyrants to raise, for decadent art to become prosperous: remember futurism, surrealism, cubism born in that time. Have they disappeared now? Oh no, they surround us, not in that rude form as then, they are perfected now and we've adapted to them: modern design, music (metal, rave, house, etc.) and even the very way of our thinking.

In the light of this the Hitler's role was rather subtle, he'd simply got the matter of the discovery. People needed someone like him, they needed the one who would give the information on what happens, why does it happen, whom to blame and how to sort the things out. People needed information as they never needed it before! They needed to KNOW as never before! The new narcotic has been discovered: the true opium for the people. And the "leaders" had got it, they shouted out: "I can say you"!

Even now can you live without TV, radio, newspapers, cellular phones and other informational feeders? Oh yes you can! But you'll feel it, you'll feel how it's PHYSICALLY painful to lose them!

Hitler was a rather normal man, not more mad than everyone who surronded him, he was not a monster as shown in numerous films and books. The psychologists who analyzed his watercolours can prove my words: he wasn't crazy. He was a victim himself: a real hostage of the informational revolution!

In the end Hitler had committed suicide. Why? Were there real reasons to do it? He would surrender as all of his comrades did. Doesn't that mean that he was on the brink of suicide many times before? Did he think that all that he does is right? No man, even crazy, can be so sure. The unstoppable and cruel river of history carried him together with his own victims into the ruin.

Do not judge people, even tyrants. Better try, try your best not to become a part of the soulless historical mechanism!

[Wanderer]

It's a mystery why he made a suicide. His "faithful" nazis commited suicide beacuse they had sweared to Hitler that if he would do it they would to it too. Hitler had serious mental problems as you can notice watching the movie The Downfall.

[Twilight Legionnaire]

After watching "Hitler: the Rise of Evil" I've got a sense that Hitler's blame for all that happened was not that serious as everyone used to think. Then after analyzing several other histories similar to the Hitler's (Stalin, Lenin, Mussolini, Mao Tse-tung) I can say that the whole process of downfall was TOTALLY uncontrollable! If it would not be Hitler then someone else.

Do you know what a bifurcation is? In synergetics it's the point of substance reorganization when the environmental conditions reach some critical point. Being a social psychologist I can say that bifurcations move the history forth. Every historical event raises from different reasons not connected with each other, but all of them together change the social environment causing an event to happen.

What were the reasons of the World War I? There were no actual reasons: it looked like the whole world has gone totally mad. What was the matter? That's simple: the human society had began its transition into another stage: informational society. The society where INFORMATION was the most important and influental thing for a being. It was the shock, the real shock of the new discovery for the whole western civilization. It was a social bifurcation. It was the reason for the so many tyrants to raise, for decadent art to become prosperous: remember futurism, surrealism, cubism born in that time. Have they disappeared now? Oh no, they surround us, not in that rude form as then, they are perfected now and we've adapted to them: modern design, music (metal, rave, house, etc.) and even the very way of our thinking.

In the light of this the Hitler's role was rather subtle, he'd simply got the matter of the discovery. People needed someone like him, they needed the one who would give the information on what happens, why does it happen, whom to blame and how to sort the things out. People needed information as they never needed it before! They needed to KNOW as never before! The new narcotic has been discovered: the true opium for the people. And the "leaders" had got it, they shouted out: "I can say you"!

Even now can you live without TV, radio, newspapers, cellular phones and other informational feeders? Oh yes you can! But you'll feel it, you'll feel how it's PHYSICALLY painful to lose them!

Hitler was a rather normal man, not more mad than everyone who surronded him, he was not a monster as shown in numerous films and books. The psychologists who analyzed his watercolours can prove my words: he wasn't crazy. He was a victim himself: a real hostage of the informational revolution!

In the end Hitler had committed suicide. Why? Were there real reasons to do it? He would surrender as all of his comrades did. Doesn't that mean that he was on the brink of suicide many times before? Did he think that all that he does is right? No man, even crazy, can be so sure. The unstoppable and cruel river of history carried him together with his own victims into the ruin.

Do not judge people, even tyrants. Better try, try your best not to become a part of the soulless historical mechanism!

Very nice post, and hell, do I agree with you on many points You show you really know what you're talking about.

Yes, Hitler was a pawn of process. Nevertheless, and even though people argue as to whether he was insane or not, his ideas and thoughts were that of a madman. I'm not saying he was, but (and I haven't specifically studied Hitler) I do believe he was influenced by such thoughts since youth, and he felt the need to implement them. Was he a tyrant? Yes. Was he a total fucking asshole? Yes. But if people think deeply into themselves, they'll probably be able to recognize that such a character could not have been any other way, due to the social environment he was in, and to the influences he grew up receiving.

[Deserter]

If you ban a song which says something about Hitler then you should ban everything eg movies. Why in movies you can put anything you like?

Anyway everything is complicated

[browneyedgirl]

I do not think Hitler was crazy--I just think he had alot of pent-up anger&he channeled it in the wrong direction. He scapegoated people. Thats wrong in any sense of the word. Plus, he did have delusions of grandeur&he forced everyone to see the World through HIS eyes.

But, he did have Charisma--that certain something that attracts people to listen&believe--which is dangerous in the wrong hands. Koresh&jim Jones had it, Stalin had it, Napoleon had it, etc.... and the world is still reeling from Hitler's influence.

We need Timo's song---its a start....let's hope he gets to do it!

[:)]

We need Timo's song---its a start....let's hope he gets to do it!

Celine Dion has commited horrible crimes against humanity through her singing and nobody stops her. And she's put out like 20 records.
I think one song about Hitler is going to tear the world apart.
As long as it doesn't make Hitler sound like a great man, because that's definately not true...

[Aresius]

i think that if the movie " American history X" is legal then timos song should be...

here (argentina) there are small groups of people called skinheads that are more or less like nazis i think that in the rest of the world too...

[Efenstor]

here (argentina) there are small groups of people called skinheads that are more or less like nazis i think that in the rest of the world too...

Oh yes, may be sure, there is a LOT of skinheads here in Russia. Some amount even in my city, though their activity here is subtile for Siberia is a multi-national region, especially now when it's being populated with numerous (mostly illegal) immigrants and guest workers from Tadzhikistan, Uzbekistan, the Caucasus region and China. But this is so here in Siberia, beyond the Urals the situation is different: major and minor skinhead organizations are prospering and acting. Russian adolescents grown in the post-Soviet ideologic vacuum grasp on the skinheads' cardboard ideas with a really fearsome enthusiasm. I have never heard a word "skinhead" from a mouth of a Russian polititian and rarely from the journalists, I think that means they're somewhat supporting their ideas or at least do not want to stand against them.

[Aresius]

here (argentina) there are small groups of people called skinheads that are more or less like nazis i think that in the rest of the world too...

Oh yes, may be sure, there is a LOT of skinheads here in Russia. Some amount even in my city, though their activity here is subtile for Siberia is a multi-national region, especially now when it's being populated with numerous (mostly illegal) immigrants and guest workers from Tadzhikistan, Uzbekistan, the Caucasus region and China. But this is so here in Siberia, beyond the Urals the situation is different: major and minor skinhead organizations are prospering and acting. Russian adolescents grown in the post-Soviet ideologic vacuum grasp on the skinheads' cardboard ideas with a really fearsome enthusiasm. I have never heard a word "skinhead" from a mouth of a Russian polititian and rarely from the journalists, I think that means they're somewhat supporting their ideas or at least do not want to stand against them.

This skinheads grous are more like "underground" its not like they kill people ( in some cases they do but small ones ) but they are really stupid.... you cant go to a party where skinheads are because you will end up in a fight..

[Invinoveritas]

Latest news from TT, the Hitler-song is renamed to Why.

[browneyedgirl]

Latest news from TT, the Hitler-song is renamed to Why.

Thats a good compromise if he had to do it.

I think that is a good question referring to Hitler&the Holocaust.
Yep---its a good, fitting Title!

[Luther_Harkon]

Well, the new name of the song is really good, something more metaphoric. But I really think that Hitler's speech haven't been deleted from the start of the song. Don't get me wrong, I HATE all that kind of ideologies that chain the hearts of the people and don't let them be free, any type of believe that makes people behave in a violent way with the others, whatever the reasons are (race, politics, money...). :pissed:

But I've heard almost all the Strato-discography, and knowing how these guys can make their instruments (and vocals) sound, I think that a great intro after the speech could be really impressive.

Well, I hope we can soon know how this whole matter ends

Luther Harkon

PD: a lot of talking of the new song in the new album, but there's a question left to me: WHEN?? (maybe there's already this info in the forum, but I haven't read it

[Freedom Fighter]

I don't understand this people, refusing a song who "talks" about this "mad"man. I really disagree with that. Not becouse i'm a Strofan. It's becouse, write something like that its a normal thing. Just that.
In my country, criticize the government becouse he leaves his people in the streets without work or criticize the militarys man who killed 30.000 persons in 1978 are normal things in the lyrics of the local bands. The 70 per cent of the bands here have lyrics about topics like these. And Nobody can reject the feelings or the opinion of the people. In the case of Timo, it's the same. He wrote a song about his feelings about Hitler, so What's wrong with that?

[Luther_Harkon]

Here in Spain, or at least in Catalonia (the region where I live, where people always claimed for independence) there are too lot's of groups who make lyrics against Franco, the f****** dictator that ruled in Spain for almost 40 years. And there where too a lot of songs against the goverment that leaded us into the Iraqi war. And nobody telled them anything.
I think that the studios wouldn't have said anything if the Tolkki wrote lyrics against Bush, except for makin them loose money in the USA. So why cannot Stratovarius tell us the kind of monster Hitler was. I really don't understand it...

Keep eatin metal & shittin chains!!! :headbang:

[Prometeus]

Hi folks

As I am form Germany, I think I'm able to add some thoughts to
this topic...

1.) It should be mentioned that Germany is the least rassistic country
in the EU nowadays. We have several anti-discrimination-laws, we give
shelter to fugitives from all over the world and it is forbidden
to spread nazi propaganda here.

2.) Strange but true: Nowadays there are more Nazis in the USA
than there were REAL nazis in the 3rd Reich! Of course it's due to
the really huge population of USA, but still worth to mention...

3.) One mentioned "european facism holding down free speech" or
something like that. Well... wake up, dude! We just have a special
institute that looks at all the crap and sometimes it says: Well, THAT
is forbidden. Here a list of typical things that are forbidden:

* Songs that tell "There was no holocaust"
* Songs that tell the listener to act violently against someone
* Songs that spread racism

You could call this "restriction of free speec" but I call it: Preventing
some assholes to spread their crap.

As Tolkki MENTIONS Hitler in his song, this institution has to see the
lyrics. But as the song will be strongly against Hitler, there will be no
problems accepting this song, so don't worry!

4.) @BrownEyedGirl: On an earlier post you said about the
line "4th Reich is rising, can't you see the signs?" "I see" or something
like that. What do you mean? Where is a 4th Reich rising? In Germany?
No chance. Even the glory US are more in danger of becoming some
kind of "We must rule all the world because the other's are less worth
than we are"-State than Germany. So, peace. At least in Germany
there is no 4th Reich rising

[MaFiaBoY]

4.) @BrownEyedGirl: On an earlier post you said about the
line "4th Reich is rising, can't you see the signs?" "I see" or something
like that. What do you mean? Where is a 4th Reich rising? In Germany?
No chance. Even the glory US are more in danger of becoming some
kind of "We must rule all the world because the other's are less worth
than we are"-State than Germany. So, peace. At least in Germany
there is no 4th Reich rising

Good point, and you're absolutely right. No other country on this planet is more likely to become "Fourth Reich" than the US. I don't think that's what TT meant when he wrote the song but when I first listened to it, it immediately made me think of it.

[browneyedgirl]

4.) @BrownEyedGirl: On an earlier post you said about the
line "4th Reich is rising, can't you see the signs?" "I see" or something
like that. What do you mean? Where is a 4th Reich rising? In Germany?
No chance. Even the glory US are more in danger of becoming some
kind of "We must rule all the world because the other's are less worth
than we are"-State than Germany. So, peace. At least in Germany
there is no 4th Reich rising

Good point, and you're absolutely right. No other country on this planet is more likely to become "Fourth Reich" than the US. I don't think that's what TT meant when he wrote the song but when I first listened to it, it immediately made me think of it.

I meant the USA---thats where I Live!
The signs ARE there... in government,&lots of people have the "all imperfection must be destroyed" hate attitude.

[Twilight Legionnaire]

Just a question.. I don't know more than a couple of words in German, but.. doesn't Reich mean Republic? If yes, then "Fourth Reich is rising" DOES apply, since the song was published not much after the german reunification.

I may be wrong, though.

[MaFiaBoY]

Nope, "Reich" means Empire. Hitler wanted his coountry to be like the great German Empire in the 18th/19th century, that's why he called it like that.

[NeonVomit]

True. Reich means Empire.

[BlackPhoenix]

4th reich can be US, but I think it is more like the east, as in Al Quaida, trying to take over the world.
maybe I'm mistaken, but that is where I see the potential to take down the imperfections and to let Islam rule.