Who is the devil, anyway?

[htcdude]

I have to disagree i'm afraid. All children are born into sin. Youc an see it from the earliest of days when a child is disobedient to their parents or something, not necessarily harmful, but signs of rebelliousness can be seen. No one is born 'good' as it were.

[Neorave]

I have to disagree i'm afraid. All children are born into sin. Youc an see it from the earliest of days when a child is disobedient to their parents or something, not necessarily harmful, but signs of rebelliousness can be seen. No one is born 'good' as it were.

I second that. This is what Christian doctrine calls "Original sin". But, through holy baptism, you are affirmed of the relationship with God.

@ topic: According to some computing services techs here on campus, the true devil is...a router!

[Carcass]

Wow, 666 views!

Obvisously, my view is incompitable with the doctrine of original sin. I'm not saying kids are all nice and sweet but i don't think there is something fundamentally evil in every person. There are reason - social, mental, even biological - to why people do what they do. People are made "evil" by lots of things in our conflict filled societies.

[Neorave]

Obvisously, my view is incompitable with the doctrine of original sin. I'm not saying kids are all nice and sweet but i don't think there is something fundamentally evil in every person. There are reason - social, mental, even biological - to why people do what they do. People are made "evil" by lots of things in our conflict filled societies.

This isn't stating that kids are evil, what this means is that when a child is born, he technically is born into sin and death.

And, for those that wonder about my last post:

@ topic: According to some computing services techs here on campus, the true devil is...a router!

That's actually a joke. But, the C.S. faculty here HATE routers with a passion!

[Carcass]

Obvisously, my view is incompitable with the doctrine of original sin. I'm not saying kids are all nice and sweet but i don't think there is something fundamentally evil in every person. There are reason - social, mental, even biological - to why people do what they do. People are made "evil" by lots of things in our conflict filled societies.

This isn't stating that kids are evil, what this means is that when a child is born, he technically is born into sin and death.

And, for those that wonder about my last post:

@ topic: According to some computing services techs here on campus, the true devil is...a router!

That's actually a joke. But, the C.S. faculty here HATE routers with a passion!

original sin = sin = bad/evil thing

born with the original sin = born bad/evil?

I might be wrong, but I've always been under the impression that we have the ability to commit a sin because of what Adam and Eve did, and that this has passed on to us and that we have it from the moment we are born. Am I wrong?

[miditek]

Obvisously, my view is incompitable with the doctrine of original sin. I'm not saying kids are all nice and sweet but i don't think there is something fundamentally evil in every person. There are reason - social, mental, even biological - to why people do what they do. People are made "evil" by lots of things in our conflict filled societies.

This isn't stating that kids are evil, what this means is that when a child is born, he technically is born into sin and death.

And, for those that wonder about my last post:

@ topic: According to some computing services techs here on campus, the true devil is...a router!

That's actually a joke. But, the C.S. faculty here HATE routers with a passion!

original sin = sin = bad/evil thing

born with the original sin = born bad/evil?

I might be wrong, but I've always been under the impression that we have the ability to commit a sin because of what Adam and Eve did, and that this has passed on to us and that we have it from the moment we are born. Am I wrong?

Another classic theological argument, and there are Biblical passages that both sides can use to support their views. This is pure Calvinism, which is a major tenant of the Protestant church, and that all are born into sin.

However, here is at least one Biblical quote that can be used to refute this claim; as Jesus said;

(Matthew 18:3) "Truly I say to you, unless you are converted and become like little children, you shall not enter the kingdom of heaven."

My personal interpretation of this passage is that a person's heart must be changed to that of an innocent, child-like nature by Christ and the grace of God. So if a child were actually "evil" at conception, then there would have been no admonition from Christ to be childlike at heart.

Nevertheless, this does not change the fact that many Christians believe that sin (or the potential to do so) is hard-coded into our DNA, from our common ancestors, Adam and Eve.

Children are not immune from the influence, effects of, or sufferings of evil. Two ten year old boys killed little two year old James Bulger in the UK about thirteen years ago. That was horrific. Children are exploited worldwide via the sex trade on a daily basis, while other children are often used as soldiers in third world countries. Four Amish schoolgirls were killed by an insane gunman in Pennsylvania yesterday.

However, I can personally take a bit of comfort with the following verse from Matthew:

Matthew 6:18 "Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a great millstone hung around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea"

Clergymen and sex traders that make careers out of abusing children would do well to heed that warning.
They will have no excuse on Judgement Day, and as such, would have been better off to have never been born.