Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Here you can talk about Stratovarius and related bands. Language used is English.
Pancio
Member
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:51 am
Location: Reggio Emilia, Italy

Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Pancio » Sun Feb 24, 2019 11:35 pm

Hi all,

Once again I'm here writing the latest news I've got a couple of days ago.

First of all thanks for your answer under my previous topic, it's nice to see a little of activity in this forum.
Second, I would like to apologize, I know I'm not the kind of guy always online.

About the topic itself:

Timo Tolkki itself, a couple of weeks ago, started to use his social media a lot more compared to the last 2/3 years.
At first I was happy but, after a couple of second, I remembered the last tour with Mike Livas and his embarrassing voice and I started to be worried about another tour with this "YouTuber" kind of singers.

After a week or so I heard a whisper by some friends near to Tolkki: he is in touch with Frontiers, once again, to produce the last chapter of the Avalon franchise.
I asked them about some details but Tolkki itself want to keep the secret along with Serafino Perugino, the head of the label.
Two days ago Tolkki decided to post the news: he'll going to release the last chapter on June 2019 and, if Frontiers agrees, there will be a tour.
No details given about guests and so on, only the title: Return to Eden.

Any guess? Idea? Thought?


Let me know!

User avatar
SentineLEX
Sr. Member
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2012 7:23 am
Location: Seattle, United States

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by SentineLEX » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:40 pm

If he does what he did in the first one I'll be happy.

Stratoviking
Sr. Member
Posts: 320
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2002 9:35 pm

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Stratoviking » Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:14 pm

I hope this Will be true, I miss Timo Tolkki alot. For me Timo tolkki
Is stratovarius.

/stratoviking

lucaf9397
Jr. Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2018 5:29 pm

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by lucaf9397 » Sat Mar 23, 2019 3:30 pm

Whatever he does, I'll be happy. I was really worried while there was no sign of him last year.

User avatar
Kmasters
Member
Posts: 271
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2005 11:47 pm

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Kmasters » Sat Apr 06, 2019 12:46 am

It seems we will have him on tour here in Colombia the local promoter is teasing on his facebook page with videos of Tolkki solo work and also Stratovarius

User avatar
Kmasters
Member
Posts: 271
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2005 11:47 pm

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Kmasters » Mon Apr 08, 2019 8:53 pm

Kmasters wrote:It seems we will have him on tour here in Colombia the local promoter is teasing on his facebook page with videos of Tolkki solo work and also Stratovarius
He COnfirmed on facebook 6 shows here in colombia along with Hammerfall in august it will be Tolkki with a local band and he hopes to do an Avalon Tour in the end of the year

User avatar
adrian9
Sr. Member
Posts: 1709
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2004 10:45 pm
Location: VENEZUELA!!!

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by adrian9 » Sat Apr 13, 2019 8:12 pm

About Avalon,

Kiske
Sammet
Matos
A9

User avatar
adrian9
Sr. Member
Posts: 1709
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2004 10:45 pm
Location: VENEZUELA!!!

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by adrian9 » Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:42 pm

TIMO TOLKKI'S AVALON will release its new album, "Return To Eden", on June 14 via Frontiers Music Srl. Guests on the disc include Todd Michael Hall (RIOT V), Mariangela Demurtas (TRISTANIA), Zachary Stevens (SAVATAGE), Anneke Van Giersbergen (THE GATHERING) and Eduard Hovinga (ELEGY).


Guess I was wrong, I think this line up is lacking a bit of power.
adrian9 wrote:About Avalon,

Kiske
Sammet
Matos
A9

User avatar
Kmasters
Member
Posts: 271
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2005 11:47 pm

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Kmasters » Mon Apr 22, 2019 5:12 pm

This sounds good it gave me a bit of Elements vibe

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuMR7XD7BE0

User avatar
NeverendingAbyss
Sr. Member
Posts: 4552
Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2008 10:41 pm
Location: Epstein didn't kill himself

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by NeverendingAbyss » Mon Apr 22, 2019 10:39 pm

Awesome! I missed hearing TT's rhythm. I don't think this album will disappoint. :P

User avatar
adrian9
Sr. Member
Posts: 1709
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2004 10:45 pm
Location: VENEZUELA!!!

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by adrian9 » Tue Apr 23, 2019 3:09 am

Kmasters wrote:This sounds good it gave me a bit of Elements vibe

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuMR7XD7BE0
that sounds really good! fingers crossed!
A9

Pancio
Member
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:51 am
Location: Reggio Emilia, Italy

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Pancio » Tue Apr 23, 2019 3:16 am

Hi all,

First single out: https://youtu.be/rzsW2rYH42c

Do you belive is Timo on the guitar? Actually I can clearly hear his touch on the rhythmic part and, of course, by the tone is him on the soloing part too but...
Stange pattern and composition for Tolkki (he is more into linear picking, legato and tapping, weird to hear some sweep picking instead), is more in the style third RR album, the one with Santtu Lehnitieimi on the guitar (or at least rumored to be).
Since the guy was on tour with him as a bassist during the "best of" tour of a couple of years ago, I was wondering if Tolkki will be only composer and producer giving up as guitarist, but we will know by the credits and I really hope is him fully restored.

Anyway good song, good melodies (although really catchy, but this is the single) and nice solo too, different is the right word.

Timo is finally back and I'm hoping for a European tour!


I want to greet him :)

Pancio
Member
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:51 am
Location: Reggio Emilia, Italy

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Pancio » Tue Apr 23, 2019 8:17 pm

Checked today the videoclip of the song, as imagined is not Timo on the guitar but, as reported on Blabbermouth and the videoclip itself, Aldo Lonobile and Santtu Lehnitiemi will be "additional guitar" while Tolkki will be "solo guitar" and "bass".

I belive this time is not him on the guitar, unfortunately, I hope he will be ready for the shows and tour, I want to see him able to play like he used to be.

Anyway, once again, good song with Glory of the World vibe on it :)

User avatar
adrian9
Sr. Member
Posts: 1709
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2004 10:45 pm
Location: VENEZUELA!!!

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by adrian9 » Wed Apr 24, 2019 11:18 pm

I´m surprised by how much I like this new tune, but also this seems to be a project put together by the label with a bunch of external songwriters aside from TT.

and isn´t Santtu Lehtiniemi the guy who supposedly did all guitars way back on the RR trinity album , I kind of remember all that drama.
A9

User avatar
SentineLEX
Sr. Member
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2012 7:23 am
Location: Seattle, United States

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by SentineLEX » Sun Apr 28, 2019 12:32 am

I'm going to pretend TT composed all of this all on his own. Chorus is unmistakably his, but either he tried something completely different when composing the verses, or he got some help.

That said, sounds promising! I like the production too.

Pancio
Member
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:51 am
Location: Reggio Emilia, Italy

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Pancio » Sun Apr 28, 2019 4:17 am

Yes, Santtu is the guy behind the "guitar-gate" in RR3/2 along with Monsanto.
I believe they've both agreed to leave this stuff behind since Santtu was also the bassist during the live show with Ladenburg, Härkin and Livas (OMG, Tolkki was bad in those shows but Livas was awful, so awful I can't stand him for more than 20 secs).

That said; surely chorus was a copy/paste of every "single" by Timo but, for instance, this is the reason why it's easy to capycat him and his songs.
Also the solo is very close to the stuff in RR3/2 and the fast tapping part and the sweep are not Tolkki's style at all (not after Dreams pace, at least, since he rely solely on alternate picking and legato in every song post-1994).

I believe this album will be ghostwrited in the style of Timo and played by others but labeled "Timo Tolkki" for publicity and the credits confirm it in a subtle way.
Also my friends in Frontiers are in "no comment" mode and this is suspicious.

Of course we will never know the truth but, given the premises of his last shows in Spain and Greece, I doubt in the past years he was able to write and play so coherently with his glorious past.

I hope I'm wrong and the future live shows will be the litmus test to see his competences on the guitar, I miss him and his playing very much from "The Great Divide" (actually one of the best work, Avalon 2 was garbage while Avalon 1 was good but a little bit average).

Well, enjoy the single, and, if you want, you can go on Amazon to listen to the classic 30secs sample (good stuff in there) :)

User avatar
HinatAArcticA
Sr. Member
Posts: 1549
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2009 11:21 am
Location: South Pole

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by HinatAArcticA » Sun Apr 28, 2019 5:37 am

DF, Sonata, Strato now Tolkki albums all in 2019.

I'll take it :)
No need to feel so afraid, colors last a lifetime and fade to gray...
Tony Kakko

ZenithMC
Member
Posts: 97
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 5:20 am
Location: United States

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by ZenithMC » Sun Apr 28, 2019 11:00 am

The song was good. I expected worse but was pleasantly surprised.
Pancio wrote:I believe this album will be ghostwrited in the style of Timo and played by others but labeled "Timo Tolkki" for publicity and the credits confirm it in a subtle way.
Also my friends in Frontiers are in "no comment" mode and this is suspicious.
Why is it that there is always this ever-looming aura of conspiracy surrounding Timo Tolkki nowadays? I cannot believe that this album is not even released yet and there are already rumors and gossip about his involvement in it. It's truly irking and, if that's really the case, then I wish he'd learn from past mistakes and be more genuine.

Pancio
Member
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:51 am
Location: Reggio Emilia, Italy

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Pancio » Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:29 am

Is not conspiracy or theories, is the fact that Timo built last years in Strato stunting and organizing publicity (along with the other guys) to bring the attention on the band.

You need to know how music business works, really: labels want profit, profit came from "brand" and, in certain ways, from skills.
Tolkki once was the mastermind behind Strato and, of course, this was his golden Era and people still listening to his works because of it.
If you have one of the most famous musician KO for years, with a contract of 3 album undone and you need cash, what would you do?

Facing the truth is hard, I'm a big fan of his works, I even bought Saana and pledged for "Credo" (the project sold to Frontiers after the failure with Symfonia and RR, if you recall those days Tolkki was playing in little club for 200/300 people max), but Tolkki's last good work was The Great Divide from Allen-Lande and is co-written with others.
Land of New Hope wasn't strong enough, even tho I enjoy it, and Angel of Apocalypse was trash in every possible way.

With this in mind listen to the song and tell me how Tolkki managed to write and play a song like this after years of nothing and years of crisis and inability to play guitar (YouTube shows Timo's health and skills one and half year ago and it's heartbreaking), tell me how he managed to use chromatic runs, sweep picking and fast tapping after vids where he cannot play even rhythmic guitar on against the wind.
It's not possible he recovered that fast with his illness and at his age.

Then go to Apple Music and listen to the sample of the other songs and you will know: Frontiers paid other musicians to play and compose song labeled "Timo Tolkki", surely this helps profit.

Of corse this could be speculation, but I know Frontiers and they're always in search of easy money with thousands of AOR shitty projects and "superbands" without any purport and purpose aside from money and profit.

That said, I believe the live shows will demonstrate that Timo is out of shape, but I hope to be denied.
About other stuff, we will never know about ghostwrited songs but I don't care: Promises is a good catchy song with old vibes on it and IDC about the writer

User avatar
HinatAArcticA
Sr. Member
Posts: 1549
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2009 11:21 am
Location: South Pole

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by HinatAArcticA » Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:37 am

Oh, Credo... I was actually looking forward to that one.
No need to feel so afraid, colors last a lifetime and fade to gray...
Tony Kakko

ZenithMC
Member
Posts: 97
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 5:20 am
Location: United States

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by ZenithMC » Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:55 pm

I'd like to open by saying this is indeed speculation, and if it turns out to not be true, then my post should be ignored, but my feelings remain unchanged. The only reason why I'm on edge about this is because Tolkki has had a checkered past with respect to honesty, in pursuit of publicity.
Pancio wrote:Is not conspiracy or theories, is the fact that Timo built last years in Strato stunting and organizing publicity (along with the other guys) to bring the attention on the band.
Perhaps "conspiracy" was a poor choice of words. "Deceptive advertising" seems a better fit. Deceptive advertising is not a good way to build any brand. It just leads to "short term gain for long term pain." That's exactly what happened to Stratovarius during and after their publicity stunt. It's better to build an image via transparency.
Pancio wrote:You need to know how music business works, really: labels want profit, profit came from "brand" and, in certain ways, from skills.
I am aware of how the music industry operates; and in a generic sense, the goal of any business is profit.
Pancio wrote:If you have one of the most famous musician KO for years, with a contract of 3 album undone and you need cash, what would you do?
I would never hope to be in such a predicament. As a composer, having someone other than myself write songs with my name on it would make me feel ashamed and disingenuous; I loath ghostwriting because of its deceptive nature. An honorable thing to do would be to publically announce that it was ghostwritten, but this is the music industry after all, and in that world, honesty and integrity are virtues.
Pancio wrote:... but Tolkki's last good work was The Great Divide from Allen-Lande and is co-written with others.
It's perfectly acceptable for Tolkki to co-write songs with others. What's not acceptable is having others write songs for him and claim and/or imply to the consumers that it was written by him. Two completely different scenarios.
Pancio wrote:With this in mind listen to the song and tell me how Tolkki managed to write and play a song like this after years of nothing and years of crisis and inability to play guitar (YouTube shows Timo's health and skills one and half year ago and it's heartbreaking), tell me how he managed to use chromatic runs, sweep picking and fast tapping after vids where he cannot play even rhythmic guitar on against the wind.
It's not possible he recovered that fast with his illness and at his age.
Sorry if I was unclear or caused confusion. I never meant to imply that you were the cause of the rumors, nor do I deny that these rumors have merit. I absolutely believe what you are saying.

I truly wish for Timo Tolkki's health to improve. It is tragic that his health is the way it is. I wish he was doing better than ever so that he could be the one to deliver an album that could rival his prior works or even surpass them. This is Timo Tolkki's own project after all; he won't be able to take pride in his work if he didn't create it himself. This is how I'd feel if I were in his position, but he might feel differently.
Pancio wrote:Then go to Apple Music and listen to the sample of the other songs and you will know: Frontiers paid other musicians to play and compose song labeled "Timo Tolkki", surely this helps profit.
Again, that is very deceptive to consumers and I do not condone such actions by the industry.
Pancio wrote:About other stuff, we will never know about ghostwrited songs but I don't care: Promises is a good catchy song with old vibes on it and IDC about the writer
I'm curious to know why you are okay with a song coined as a "Timo Tolkki song" being ghostwritten. Is this just what is expected of Tolkki nowadays? I hope I don't come off as rash or rude, I'm genuinely intrigued.
HinatAArcticA wrote:Oh, Credo... I was actually looking forward to that one.
Agreed. Classical Variations and Themes is awesome and I was hoping for a sequel.

lucaf9397
Jr. Member
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2018 5:29 pm

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by lucaf9397 » Sat May 18, 2019 9:00 am


User avatar
Mr Hadder
Member
Posts: 124
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:15 pm

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Mr Hadder » Mon May 20, 2019 4:58 pm

Here you have the 2nd Avalon single for the upcoming album "Return to Eden"; Hear my Call Feat Anneke Van Giersbergen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lxn_OO0 ... rt_radio=1

User avatar
HinatAArcticA
Sr. Member
Posts: 1549
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2009 11:21 am
Location: South Pole

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by HinatAArcticA » Wed May 22, 2019 8:14 am

I'm just so happy to see Timo smiling and doing alright for himself. I was seriously concerned with the shows last time where he just didn't look good at all. He looks livelier than he has in years.
No need to feel so afraid, colors last a lifetime and fade to gray...
Tony Kakko

User avatar
SentineLEX
Sr. Member
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2012 7:23 am
Location: Seattle, United States

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by SentineLEX » Mon May 27, 2019 5:11 am

I don't like this one tbh. I feel like Anneke's melody line moves around a lot but there isn't a lot of dynamism in the rest of the main instruments. The bass stays on the same note for the entire verse, the chord changes are pretty safe and uninteresting throughout the chorus, and there's nothing I could say that's bold, or captures my attention, or wakes me up at all.

It's the musical equivalent of marching in place for 5 minutes

Empathica1928
Sr. Member
Posts: 426
Joined: Thu Aug 13, 2009 10:43 pm

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Empathica1928 » Wed May 29, 2019 6:25 pm

The two songs I've heard so far blow. Again, nothing good since Symfonia, and even that was, at best, a bunch of good and half-decent Stratovarius songs played by a B-rate Stratovarius.

Sigh.

User avatar
Mr Hadder
Member
Posts: 124
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:15 pm

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by Mr Hadder » Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:42 am

The album has leaked. I quite liked it!

User avatar
robocop
Member
Posts: 92
Joined: Sun Jun 09, 2019 12:12 am
Location: Erectionland
Contact:

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by robocop » Sun Jun 09, 2019 12:31 am

I’m just surprised he’s still at it.

User avatar
SentineLEX
Sr. Member
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2012 7:23 am
Location: Seattle, United States

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by SentineLEX » Sun Jun 09, 2019 1:10 am

Mr Hadder wrote:The album has leaked. I quite liked it!
Where'd you find the leak?

User avatar
robocop
Member
Posts: 92
Joined: Sun Jun 09, 2019 12:12 am
Location: Erectionland
Contact:

Re: Timo Tolkki's Avalon Pt. 3 and tour

Post by robocop » Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:25 pm

SentineLEX wrote:
Mr Hadder wrote:The album has leaked. I quite liked it!
Where'd you find the leak?
Search for the torrent on DuckDuckGo.

Post Reply